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Originally posted by metcarfre

I was curious as to whether anyone's tried the old trick I was taught, to have one person sight the direction on a compass, send another out with a taut rope at that angle, lather, rinse, repeat? I've heard of it being used in whiteouts on relatively flat terrain (glaciers etc.) and was wondering how well it worked?

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Originally posted by metcarfre

I was curious as to whether anyone's tried the old trick I was taught, to have one person sight the direction on a compass, send another out with a taut rope at that angle, lather, rinse, repeat? I've heard of it being used in whiteouts on relatively flat terrain (glaciers etc.) and was wondering how well it worked?

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Originally posted by scottN

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Originally posted by metcarfre

I was curious as to whether anyone's tried the old trick I was taught, to have one person sight the direction on a compass, send another out with a taut rope at that angle, lather, rinse, repeat? I've heard of it being used in whiteouts on relatively flat terrain (glaciers etc.) and was wondering how well it worked?

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When I've done this both people move at the same time. The person in the back has the compass and shouts directions (left, right) to the person in front. It works a lot better than trying to follow a compass bearing with the compass in your hand.

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Originally posted by johngenx

I have taught people navigation skills, and invariably they all show up with GPS units at the ready. Yes, I use GPS, and use it heavily in the winter, especially on large glaciers and other areas without features. However, it is not to be relied on. Units can break (had that happen), get dropped (no such thing as a drop-proof anything!) or whatever.

Also, relying on the trackback feature can get you killed in the wrong terrain. The accuracy of the track is not fine enough to know where to put your feet. Skiing down a large glacier, sure, but navigating a corniced ridge? Not on your life.

So, in order of skills, I rank:

1. Route finding and recon. Pay close attention to the nuances of the terrain, stop, turn around and examine your route frequently so you know what it looks like from the other direction, memorize landmarks (big and small) and perhaps mark significant/dangerous spots if conditions warranty. Leaving a trekking pole at a critical turn on a ridge can be a life saver. Wands work well in the winter, and I'm surprised at how few people set out on places like the Columbia Icefields without them. Your brain is the number one navigational tool, so learn to use it.

2. Map and compass. You cannot find your way through difficult/technical terrain with a map. Even 50,000:1 or finer maps are too damn big. But, knowing how to use a map and compass can keep you moving in poor conditions if you're in large terrain. It can help you locate handrails, features, and large obstacles.

3. GPS. The newest GPS units are great. This last winter we had a several days of total whiteout navigation (couldn't see my roped partners, the "inside a ping-pong ball" conditions, and btw, it can be terribly disorienting and even make you dizzy and nauseous) and by using the gps and wands, it really sped things up. We had two units, some spare batteries, and map/compass as well.

In terms of moving or not, my rule is that if I can't be certain that my next step is on solid terrain, I don't make that step. If the visibility is so bad that I'm in serious jeopardy of walking off a ridge, I'll stop. Stopping in poor weather sucks, yes, but I'd rather spend a cold/wet period out gnawing on some frozen Snickers bars then riding home in a body bag.

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Originally posted by LeeL

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Originally posted by scottN

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Originally posted by metcarfre

I was curious as to whether anyone's tried the old trick I was taught, to have one person sight the direction on a compass, send another out with a taut rope at that angle, lather, rinse, repeat? I've heard of it being used in whiteouts on relatively flat terrain (glaciers etc.) and was wondering how well it worked?

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When I've done this both people move at the same time. The person in the back has the compass and shouts directions (left, right) to the person in front. It works a lot better than trying to follow a compass bearing with the compass in your hand.

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In a glacier I send the person who's heaviest in front and they will probe the route. The fact that I am a pinner 155lbs soaking wet has little to do with that decision.

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Originally posted by BCBoy
I wouldn't send the heaviest person first if the person is the most experienced of the rope team. I would keep your most experienced person in the rear of the rope team so when the first person falls into a crevasse the most experienced person in the rear will have the skill to anchor and assist in the rescue of the first person -- this is especially critical if the first person probing the route is unconscious from the fall or if your rope team is only two people (i want my buddy to know how to rig up a 3:1 pulley system so that he can pull my limp unconscious body).

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Originally posted by LeeL

Yup _ I was kidding

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