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207 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2012 : 12:08 PM
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I've read lots of pro and con reports on Dynafit bindings, but too many from theorists. Is there anybody out there who's used a set for a couple of years and can give me first-hand feedback? Some background:
I telied for over 20 years before my third knee blow-out convinced me to transfer to AT. Since then I've used Diamir Freerides and, weight aside, I'm quite happy with them. I fall frequently. Years of telemarking have taught me how to survive most falls but a couple of times a year I'll have a yard-sale blow-out, where you have to have your skis release. One review of Dynafits I read said you don't want to fall in them, and I just can't ski like that.
Recognizing no binding is perfect, they all pre-release at times or fail to release when you want them to, I'd much appreciate some thoughts from users. I'd be keeping the Freerides for lift skiing, mounting Dynafits on a set of Movement Couloirs with the intention of using them 80% backcountry, 20% lift. |
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Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
793 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2012 : 12:39 PM
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Dynafits rock.
I've skied an alpine binding like 5 times.
I've skied fritschi's maybe 4 times.
I've skied my dynafits like 100+ times. Nothing has broken. I've never not come out of a ski when I needed to (I fall a lot, I'm not very good). When the binding has been properly adjusted to my bootsize, and the release value has been properly set, I have only pre-released once.
You have to make sure your toe is popped in properly. A common thing with newbies to dynafits is they got snow under the toepiece which doesn't allow it to close fully on the boot. They then ski down hill and release from the toe. A simple check and pop of the toe piece when changing modes is all you need to avoid this. Now I know what to look for...it's never happened again.
I'm 175lbs and have skied them badly with a 50lb pack and they stay on.
I've skied resort days (only like 4 though!)
I have friends who ski 110mm+ skis with them no problem (one who has some 130mm-ish with dynafits on!)
One minor plus no-one mentions...they're quiet when you skin! Step-in bindings clack clack clack plastic on plastic. Dynafit: it's boot rubber on plastic. Oh so quiet.
No regrets. |
Edited by - booewen on 01/27/2012 12:40 PM |
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136 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2012 : 3:05 PM
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We have had Dynafit bindings for maybe 10 years. Really like the light weight and never had problems. Never had them not release when I wanted them to.
Couple of things:
1) Make sure you always crank up the front lever to walk position when you are walking. Occasionally snow/ice gets stuck in the toe piece which can make this difficult. Clean the opening or better; stick a tiny piece of closed cell foam in there. I don’t know if this is a problem with the newer Dynafit bindings.
2) You may want some more substantial bindings if you plan to huck big cliffs and get lots of air.
3) Ski brakes don’t seem to work well with our version of dynafits, but I haven’t fiddled much with it and I’m not sure if the newer type bindings are better.
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Finally stopping that crazy suffering that is ice, climbing to concentrate on great ski tours!
3502 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2012 : 3:17 PM
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Some things I don't like about Freerides: (skied one year on them, three on Dynafits)
1. Don't fall when skinning. On steep, slippery skin tracks, I occasionally might fall. Fritchis can easily break if you fall forward when they are in touring mode.
2. Heavy. They're 2-2.5x heavier than brake-equipped Dynafits.
3. Stack height. Your boot is quite a ways off the ski. Some like this, but I prefer skiing the Dynafits.
4. Clackity clack.
Things I do like:
1. On rolling terrain, ski/tour transitions are a breeze.
2. Easy in! Step-in, and make those turns!
3. Great brakes. They work.
4. Alpine style release: DIN
Dynafits:
Good:
1. Light. I love my fat G3 Manhattan skis, and they go uphill pretty well thanks to the light weight of Dynafits.
2. Touring action. Very smooth.
3. Low stack height and solid feel while skiing.
4. Uber-reliable.
Bad:
1. Getting into them on a steep slope in deep snow is a challenge. My old Garmont boots don't have the easy-in fittings of most new boots.
2. Skinning in deep, heavy snow, the older models can rotate the heel when snow builds up behind your boot heel.
3. Skiing to touring means skis off.
4. Brakes are wimpy.
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As for release with Dynafits, I ski pretty conservatively and try (try!) not to fall. But, I do, and have released when needed, and only once when I didn't want to. That said, my pre-release was on a steep, icy constriction and I was attempting a jump turn and had a big pack on. Poor technique combined with a lot more weight than my RV setting is really for had one of my skis come off. I'm not sure a FR binding wouldn't have released as well.
As for the rolling terrain, one thing about FR's is that you should never ski with the heels loose. You can torque the binding and break it quite easily. With Dynafits, I can't tour/ski switch easily, but I can ski down quite a bit with my heels loose, so I don't need as many transitions anyway.
Last Sunday, we were skiing down a creek near Lake Louise, and it was "rolling" in a general down, and I stripped my skins and left my Dynafits in touring mode, allowing me to "kick" on the flatter parts. What killed me was my AWESOME glide wax job, which had me sailing on any of the down sections, but struggling if the the route had a 1% up grade... :-)
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north vancouver, british columbia
Canada
605 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2012 : 4:00 PM
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| Maybe give the G3 Onyx a try.... They may suit your needs! Looks like johngenx has given some great advice! I have used all three bindings, and they all seem to have there place in the ski world.... |
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Kootenay Bud
2695 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2012 : 7:01 PM
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I probably have 800 days on my first pair. They are now on my rock skis but are still going strong. They release when they should, don't release when they shouldn't - as long as the DIN is set right. I know some people leave them in tour mode (front lever cranked up) when they are skiing no fall zones, so you could do that if you are doing some extreme skiing in them.
The whole thing about having to take your ski off to switch to tour mode takes maybe 3 seconds and doesn't even require bending over - you can do it all with your pole. If you are going to be skinning up, your skis have to come off in any case.
I ski with lots of different people, and the weight differential makes a big difference in how tired people are at the top of the climb, so I would say if you want to seriously tour, light weight should be a big priority with you. |
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207 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2012 : 12:19 PM
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| Thanks people, excellent feedback, exactly what I was looking for. Many of the points you make are supported in reviews elsewhere but the it's been very difficult to get info on releasability. Dynafits had a reputation for pre-releasing at one time. As some of you imply, correct set-up is so important. I was getting pre-releases on my Freerides before somebody gave me advice on fine-tuning the set-up. Not looking forward to going back to ski-leashes, but I used to manage with them OK and the silver lining is not having to hunt for a white ski under two feet of mashed potatoes. |
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Vancouver, BC
Canada
1461 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2012 : 6:29 PM
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Most of the pre-release issues were from when they had the small gap between the boot and the heel piece. Hard flexing of the ski could push the toe out. They increased the gap slightly and in the latest model they have added stops to the toe piece to try and mitigate this effect.
The other change is, now the heel piece only rotates in one direction and the heel elevators are simply flipped into position instead of rotating the heel. This is to prevent the heel piece from rotating while skinning and, I have to admit, the risers are WAY easier to change. This does sacrifice some ease of switching between ski and tour mode. The simplicity Sandy mentioned only applies if you don't have brakes, IMO, which make things a little trickier. It's not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.
I have had a few seasons on the Vertical ST and some time on the newer Radical ST. I think that they are great. I've skied mine pretty hard with quite a few resort days, some no release zone skiing over bergshrunds and in steep couloirs and some drops to soft snow, but I'm also not all that big.
I popped out of them quite a bit for a while until I discovered THE secret to worry free downhills. When you engage the toes, pull up the toe lever and swing the ski a few times. Repeat until the toe pulls up fully. Between pressure melting and the little grooves in the teeth, this completely cleans out the toe pieces of the boot. No pre-clearing necessary. |
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1448 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2012 : 6:39 PM
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I have older model and my only issues are snow and ice build up under the heel skinning. Then it eventually causes the tower or heel piece to rotate. Which releases the ski brake and is very difficult to push the brake down and rotate the tower back.
Other issue is older mod you have to rotate tower for heel lift compaired to new mod.
Beyond that it's a cool system once you learn the tricks to get into the binding
2. Skinning in deep, heavy snow, the older models can rotate the heel when snow builds up behind your boot heel. |
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Finally stopping that crazy suffering that is ice, climbing to concentrate on great ski tours!
3502 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2012 : 8:13 PM
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I understand that if you take the brakes off, the problem of the heel piece rotating while skinning is reduced/solved. Since the brakes are pretty wimpy, I have thought about taking mine off, but haven't for a one main reason...
I ski them inbounds, and really don't want to ski with leashes.
I have a pair of Dynafit Mustagh Ata Super-Light skis, and they have the Dynafit ST bindings mounted, including brakes. I have considered stripping those off and remounting with the newer Dynafit Speed Radicals. But, the Mustagh Ata skis have the factory inserts, and reusing them is a bit of a trick. Also, now that I don't have pro-purchase, the cash layout would be an ouch to save not a ton of weight.
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Finally stopping that crazy suffering that is ice, climbing to concentrate on great ski tours!
3502 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2012 : 8:18 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by hafilax
I popped out of them quite a bit for a while until I discovered THE secret to worry free downhills. When you engage the toes, pull up the toe lever and swing the ski a few times. Repeat until the toe pulls up fully. Between pressure melting and the little grooves in the teeth, this completely cleans out the toe pieces of the boot. No pre-clearing necessary.
^^^^This! I have developed a habit of swinging the ski to seat the jaws anytime I'm stepping in, be it for skinning or skiing, and wow, it WORKS. Forgot this little tip, thanks for putting it in. |
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Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
793 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2012 : 08:19 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by johngenx
I understand that if you take the brakes off, the problem of the heel piece rotating while skinning is reduced/solved.
I don't have brakes on my Comforts. They still rotate in warm sticky spring conditions when the snow builds up on the heel. |
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Finally stopping that crazy suffering that is ice, climbing to concentrate on great ski tours!
3502 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2012 : 1:58 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by booewen
I don't have brakes on my Comforts. They still rotate in warm sticky spring conditions when the snow builds up on the heel.
Well, then I won't bother stripping my brakes. |
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Whistler, BC
Canada
1174 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2012 : 3:09 PM
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quote:
quote:
Originally posted by booewen
I don't have brakes on my Comforts. They still rotate in warm sticky spring conditions when the snow builds up on the heel.
Well, then I won't bother stripping my brakes.
The problem isn't solely the brakes, but the brakes do exacerbate the problem. The problem is that the portion of the Dynafit heelpiece that nearly makes contact with the back of the boot is prone to icing. This creates a "camming" effect which can rotate the heelpiece. I notice much less of a problem without the brakes, but even more improvement by using a car wax occasionally on the affected portion of the binding. This causes the icy build-up to shed more regularly and prevents the camming. |
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Vancouver
Canada
55 Posts |
Posted - 02/25/2012 : 10:40 PM
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| I need to car wax my whole top ski, I get build up like crazy. |
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207 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2012 : 3:31 PM
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| Got my Radical STs mounted last week and although I haven't skinned with them yet, I got 30 runs of lift skiing in and I'm delighted. Not as difficult to enter and exit as I'd feared, very precise, no pre-release even with some bump skiing, and the difference in weight compared with a pair of Fritschi-mounted skis, when you pick them up, is amazing. Now I'm really looking forward to getting the skins on. Thanks again to all for your feedback. |
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1448 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2012 : 5:05 PM
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Nice the Radicals are the improved dynafits,
-Heel lifter flipper
-the towner,heel unit is intended to be rotated in only one direction
http://www.wildsnow.com/4828/dynafit-radical-backcountry-skiing/
Wish they would make a upgrade kit for older towners for the fipper and rotating in one direction.. ;- P
with the
 quote:
Originally posted by howes hound
Got my Radical STs mounted last week and although I haven't skinned with them yet, I got 30 runs of lift skiing in and I'm delighted. Not as difficult to enter and exit as I'd feared, very precise, no pre-release even with some bump skiing, and the difference in weight compared with a pair of Fritschi-mounted skis, when you pick them up, is amazing. Now I'm really looking forward to getting the skins on. Thanks again to all for your feedback.
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18 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2012 : 6:11 PM
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Started off with Silvrettas in the early '90's, moved to Fritschis when the Titanal series came out, and now have a pair of 2008 Dynafit Verticals and a pair of the 2011 version G3 Onyx.
I use the Dynafits for longer trips - Spearhead, Neve, icefields, and big day tours when some distance is getting covered. For downhill orientated trips I use the G3's. The Dynafits are nice and light, and work very well. Like all tech bindings, getting in and out takes some getting used to, but only for the first few trips.
I prefer the G3 Onyx for downhill trips as they feel a bit more solid and they seem to release more effectively when needed. They are heavier though. Lots of people had problems with the first beta version of these, mine are the latest ones with the red inserts. I have had no issues to date, and the G3 factory is right here in North Vancouver if any issues do crop up. |
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89 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2012 : 7:05 PM
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To Grimgrak and msulkers
quote:
The problem isn't solely the brakes, but the brakes do exacerbate the problem. The problem is that the portion of the Dynafit heelpiece that nearly makes contact with the back of the boot is prone to icing. This creates a "camming" effect which can rotate the heelpiece. I notice much less of a problem without the brakes, but even more improvement by using a car wax occasionally on the affected portion of the binding. This causes the icy build-up to shed more regularly and prevents the camming.
Could give me a link to the wax you are using? I am interested to fight the icing effect,
quite annoying, I would say.
Thanks |
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Qualicum Beach, BC
Canada
1301 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2012 : 8:17 PM
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I'm in the same boat as rodin... long skinny tele skis, with leather boots, that should have gone to the dump decades earlier... then straight skis, Silvretta bindings and Scarpa Vega mountaineering boots. A great way to learn how to hate backcountry skiing!
Still, I also progressed through the Fritschi Faze and fell on the alter of Dynafit and here I find myself an acolyte of Dynafit.
I have skied on Dynafit Comforts for several years and like them, except for the heel post rotation problem... and the toe fixing fussiness. I tried Onyx for a year, hoping for a simpler fix, but in the end went back to Dynafit (mostly because of weight).
The new Dynafit Radical's were supposed to address all of the old problems, but seem to be bringing up new problems of their own.
quote:
Originally posted by rodin
Started off with Silvrettas in the early '90's, moved to Fritschis when the Titanal series came out, and now have a pair of 2008 Dynafit Verticals and a pair of the 2011 version G3 Onyx.
I use the Dynafits for longer trips - Spearhead, Neve, icefields, and big day tours when some distance is getting covered. For downhill orientated trips I use the G3's. The Dynafits are nice and light, and work very well. Like all tech bindings, getting in and out takes some getting used to, but only for the first few trips.
I prefer the G3 Onyx for downhill trips as they feel a bit more solid and they seem to release more effectively when needed. They are heavier though. Lots of people had problems with the first beta version of these, mine are the latest ones with the red inserts. I have had no issues to date, and the G3 factory is right here in North Vancouver if any issues do crop up.
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Vancouver, BC
Canada
1461 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2012 : 8:47 PM
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| I have Dynafit Verticals and Radicals. The heel lifters of the Radicals are way better. You can switch with a little flick of the pole. The toe piece towers do nothing for me AFAICT. I haven't toured enough to experience the heel piece rotation but it is a bit annoying that you can't easily lock the heel with skins on for sketchy skin descents without taking your skis off. |
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Dynafit bindings - feeback requested
