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 Denatured Alcohol/Methylated Spirits
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synwars
Starting Member


Abbotsford, BC
Canada

38 Posts

 Posted - 09/21/2011 :  9:24 PM  Show Profile  Reply to this posting
In doing research for sourcing Denatured Alcohol in Canada, it appears that it is difficult to find, making shopping for it in the US as the only option. To share, I found out that Steveston Marine (Vancouver, Richmond, Langley) carries Capt Phab DA in a 90:10 mix, that is 90%Ethanol:10%Methanol. 2 sizes to choose from, I got the 4L bottle for $26.09 plus HST. That works out to approx $6.50/litre.

Enjoy your pop can stoves everyone.

Sam.

paulyman
Intermediate Member



543 Posts

 Posted - 09/21/2011 :  9:53 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Also mixes well with Cola and a wedge of lime :) some would know this drink as a Cuba Libre :)


Edited by - paulyman on 09/21/2011 10:11 PM

synwars
Starting Member


Abbotsford, BC
Canada

38 Posts

 Posted - 09/21/2011 :  10:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by paulyman

Also mixes well with Cola and a wedge of lime :) some would know this drink as a Cuba Libre :)





Well, for that I would recommend Flor de Caña Rum. Would taste a lot better and wouldn't cause blindness like Methynol would... Well depending on how many Cuba Libres one drinks. :-P

paulyman
Intermediate Member



543 Posts

 Posted - 09/21/2011 :  10:22 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Flor de Caña Rum or Denatured alcohol, same thing
quote:
Originally posted by synwars

quote:
Originally posted by paulyman

Also mixes well with Cola and a wedge of lime :) some would know this drink as a Cuba Libre :)





Well, for that I would recommend Flor de Caña Rum. Would taste a lot better and wouldn't cause blindness like Methynol would... Well depending on how many Cuba Libres one drinks. :-P

DeNomad
New Member


Edmonton, AB
Canada

63 Posts

 Posted - 09/22/2011 :  06:09 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I don't think you looked hard enough...

Recochem Methyl Hydrate 3.78 L for about $4 at Home Depot. I've been on the same bottle for two years with my pop can stove. It even says "for use with marine stoves" on the container. I even used it to clean up a paint spill once ;)

http://www.homedepot.ca/product/methyl-hydrate-378-l/912218

Hiking Solo
Junior Member


Not too far from Edmonton, Alberta
Canada

230 Posts

 Posted - 09/22/2011 :  06:10 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DeNomad

I don't think you looked hard enough...

Recochem Methyl Hydrate 3.78 L for about $4 at Home Depot. I've been on the same bottle for two years with my pop can stove. It even says "for use with marine stoves" on the container. I even used it to clean up a paint spill once ;)

http://www.homedepot.ca/product/methyl-hydrate-378-l/912218




They sell the same stuff (but in a smaller bottle) at MEC as well. That's where I picked mine up....
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Wulf2
Junior Member


Dewdney, BC
Canada

485 Posts

 Posted - 09/22/2011 :  08:12 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The last 4 ltr. jug of methyl hydrate I bought was $12 and change at Cloverdale Paint . Most building supplies / paint stores and automotive jobbers have the stuff .

Wulf

synwars
Starting Member


Abbotsford, BC
Canada

38 Posts

 Posted - 09/22/2011 :  08:34 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DeNomad

I don't think you looked hard enough...

Recochem Methyl Hydrate 3.78 L for about $4 at Home Depot. I've been on the same bottle for two years with my pop can stove. It even says "for use with marine stoves" on the container. I even used it to clean up a paint spill once ;)

http://www.homedepot.ca/product/methyl-hydrate-378-l/912218




Haha, nice try. I know you can use Methyl Hydrate in a pop can stove, but it is not the same thing. Do your research.

I posted this to help others who wish to use Denatured Alcohol in their stove to find an easier source, not to compare the price of two different fuels.

peter1955
Advanced Member



2428 Posts

 Posted - 09/22/2011 :  09:52 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I guess the BIG question is whether youi can use ethyl alcohol in your stove.

Then if you can't get the stove to work, you can drink it and you won't care.

scottN
Senior Member


Vancouver, BC
Canada

1518 Posts

 Posted - 09/22/2011 :  6:16 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by peter1955

I guess the BIG question is whether youi can use ethyl alcohol in your stove.

Then if you can't get the stove to work, you can drink it and you won't care.



Many alcohol stoves are designed to burn ethanol or denatured ethanol (90% ethanol, 10% methanol). If you use 100% methanol (methyl hydrate) in a stove it won't burn as hot. Ethanol has a substantially higher specific heat of combustion.

Methanol = 22.7MJ/kg
Ethanol = 29.7MJ/kg
Gasoline = 47.3MJ/kg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_of_combustion
http://www.trangiastove.co.uk/trangia-fuel-information.php

peter1955
Advanced Member



2428 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  08:23 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by scottN

quote:
Originally posted by peter1955

I guess the BIG question is whether youi can use ethyl alcohol in your stove.

Then if you can't get the stove to work, you can drink it and you won't care.



Many alcohol stoves are designed to burn ethanol or denatured ethanol (90% ethanol, 10% methanol). If you use 100% methanol (methyl hydrate) in a stove it won't burn as hot. Ethanol has a substantially higher specific heat of combustion.

Methanol = 22.7MJ/kg
Ethanol = 29.7MJ/kg
Gasoline = 47.3MJ/kg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_of_combustion
http://www.trangiastove.co.uk/trangia-fuel-information.php



Yeah. But you can't drink it if it's got methanol in it.
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Sodbuster
Senior Member


High River, (just south of Calgary eh!), Alberta
Canada

1880 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  08:33 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
What is the marine application for this product?

DeNomad
New Member


Edmonton, AB
Canada

63 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  08:46 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Sodbuster

What is the marine application for this product?



I believe the marine application is to run cooking stoves.


@ScottN & @synwars, methyl hydrate burns hot enough to boil with in winter. I have a stand which both holds my pot over the stove and raises the stove off the table/ground. I then put a cut off bottom from a beer can under the stove and put some fuel in that - it acts as a super primer for the stove. It'll get water boiling in no time.

Also why so much effort to find denatured alcohol when the methyl hydrate is so much cheaper and easier to find?

That being said I think I am going to buy a MSR whisperlite in the future. I am getting tired of refilling my beer can stove halfway through cooking.

synwars
Starting Member


Abbotsford, BC
Canada

38 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  09:11 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DeNomad

quote:
Originally posted by Sodbuster

What is the marine application for this product?



I believe the marine application is to run cooking stoves.


@ScottN & @synwars, methyl hydrate burns hot enough to boil with in winter. I have a stand which both holds my pot over the stove and raises the stove off the table/ground. I then put a cut off bottom from a beer can under the stove and put some fuel in that - it acts as a super primer for the stove. It'll get water boiling in no time.

Also why so much effort to find denatured alcohol when the methyl hydrate is so much cheaper and easier to find?


I'm not arguing not to use MH, go ahead and use it if it suits you. The reasons I prefer DA are that it is safer to use and handle, it has a hotter burn, and it can still be used to clean/disinfect.

Only downside I see is, as Peter1955 mentioned, you cannot drink it. Which is tempting because it smells like vodka!

nmcan84
Senior Member


in da bush, alberta
Canada

1074 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  09:17 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by peter1955

quote:
Originally posted by scottN

quote:
Originally posted by peter1955

I guess the BIG question is whether youi can use ethyl alcohol in your stove.

Then if you can't get the stove to work, you can drink it and you won't care.



Many alcohol stoves are designed to burn ethanol or denatured ethanol (90% ethanol, 10% methanol). If you use 100% methanol (methyl hydrate) in a stove it won't burn as hot. Ethanol has a substantially higher specific heat of combustion.

Methanol = 22.7MJ/kg
Ethanol = 29.7MJ/kg
Gasoline = 47.3MJ/kg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_of_combustion
http://www.trangiastove.co.uk/trangia-fuel-information.php



Yeah. But you can't drink it if it's got methanol in it.




sure you can

peter1955
Advanced Member



2428 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  09:53 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nmcan84
Many alcohol stoves are designed to burn ethanol or denatured ethanol (90% ethanol, 10% methanol). If you use 100% methanol (methyl hydrate) in a stove it won't burn as hot. Ethanol has a substantially higher specific heat of combustion.




Yeah. But you can't drink it if it's got methanol in it.

[/quote]

sure you can
[/quote]

Kills 1/3, blinds 1/3, and just gets the other 1/3 drunk. At least that's the ratio I was told.

tu
Senior Member


Burnaby, BC
Canada

1715 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  10:09 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
There's some irony in that methanol is added to ethanol to make it unsuitable for consumption, but one treatment for methanol poisoning is to intravenously inject ethanol.

I've shied away from alcohol stoves because of fears with methanol skin absorption, and how it damages the nervous system.

So for people using methanol - how do you handle it, i.e., when pouring and ensuring it doesn't contaminate your food and utensils?
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Hiker Boy
Advanced Member

opinionated-stove huggin'-fleece wearin'-arse burnin' hill virgin

Here
Canada

4667 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  10:23 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by tu



I've shied away from alcohol stoves because of fears with methanol skin absorption, and how it damages the nervous system.

So for people using methanol - how do you handle it, i.e., when pouring and ensuring it doesn't contaminate your food and utensils?



I use methanol at work and have used it for ~ 26 years. Casual skin contact is a daily occurrence. Unless you are bathing in it, toxicity from skin contact is a little overblown.


As for how I use it with my stoves....I carry and pour it from my Brasslite fuel bottle....

peter1955
Advanced Member



2428 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  10:33 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
^^^I have a bit of nerve damage in my arms from using varsol to wash parts many years ago. You might want to reconsider how you use methanol per the MSDS.

cambium
Advanced Member



3022 Posts

 Posted - 09/23/2011 :  10:49 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by scottN

quote:
Originally posted by peter1955

I guess the BIG question is whether youi can use ethyl alcohol in your stove.

Then if you can't get the stove to work, you can drink it and you won't care.



Many alcohol stoves are designed to burn ethanol or denatured ethanol (90% ethanol, 10% methanol). If you use 100% methanol (methyl hydrate) in a stove it won't burn as hot. Ethanol has a substantially higher specific heat of combustion.

Methanol = 22.7MJ/kg
Ethanol = 29.7MJ/kg
Gasoline = 47.3MJ/kg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_of_combustion
http://www.trangiastove.co.uk/trangia-fuel-information.php




Different stove that I use, MSR , I put in a blend of MoHawk 94 octane-Ethanol gas mixed with White-gas , and that gets me a nice hot clean blue flame.
Different stoves , I know.

Chingyul
New Member


Calgary, Alberta
Canada

76 Posts

 Posted - 09/25/2011 :  4:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Good find. I've been trying to find some denatured ethanol here as well. Fewer marine shops here in Alberta.

Been using the home depot stuff, but I have concern about contact as well. Would rather go with a mix with mostly ethanol. The extra heat it puts out is a bonus.
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