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 Mysterious, pop can stove stashin', gps totin', overnighter virgin, wannabe tentmaker and foul weather wuss who rides a thumper to the trailhead with wonderdog Max to hike the Chilliwack Valley
Chwk
Canada
4921 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 12:08 AM
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While snowshoeing in Manning this past weekend, we had one of those MOUNTAIN HOUSE freeze-dried meals as our "lunch".
Chicken and Rice was quite tasty, and at $5.88 (Bellingham Walmart) not too pricey as a meal for two.
While munching on this, I got to thinking that it would be quite easy to make dehydrated meals like this...except for the sturdy foil pouch that holds it all together.
So is there anywhere that one can BUY these foil pouch/Ziploc's for DIY meals? I don't think a regular Ziploc would handle the boiling water for very long. This thing was quite robust and could even stand on its own while "cooking". |
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North Vancouver, BC
Canada
1656 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 01:07 AM
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I've wondered the same. I'm sure you can buy them because Mountain House and all the other companies are buying them from a supplier. I'm not sure if they are available to consumers in small quantities. I haven't found them yet.
This isn't a stand-up bag but it might do the trick:
http://www.qbag.com/
I don't know if all "foil bags" would hold up to the heat well so I'd like to find a supplier that specifically states that the bag will work for that purpose. Foil bags can be quite complicated. Check out this:
http://www.pacs4i.com/foil_bags.html
"Depending on packaging requirements, foil pouches are constructed of materials in two to four layer laminations. Whatever your needs, you can be sure of a low MVTR, or moisture vapor transmission rate. To meet typical moisture-protection foil bags use polyester, polyethylene, foil, Surlyn and paper in these different laminations.
• Polyester/Foil/Polyethylene Foil Laminates
• Clay Coated Paper/Foil/Polyethylene Foil Laminations
• Metalized Polyester/Polyethylene Foil Laminations
• Clear “Foil” Laminates
• Puncture Resistant Foil Laminates with Nylon"
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Mysterious, pop can stove stashin', gps totin', overnighter virgin, wannabe tentmaker and foul weather wuss who rides a thumper to the trailhead with wonderdog Max to hike the Chilliwack Valley
Chwk
Canada
4921 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 01:29 AM
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Lots of suppliers on the net...but I don't feel like buying a case of 500!
Was hoping to score a LOCAL source with smaller numbers, say a dozen or so.
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Edited by - TheShadow on 01/04/2011 01:29 AM |
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Calgary, Alberta
Andorra
3830 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 01:41 AM
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Note that ziplocs are often more robust than you think. Especially if you are looking for single-use. I have cooked chili and eggs and more with boiling water in ziplocs. Test them at home, and you might be pleasantly surprised.
Admittedly, they don't stand up on their own (though they are sealable so you don't need them standing, and can shake them around), and they don't insulate your hands from the heat very well (but make a lovely hand-warmer with a light pair of gloves). |
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Outward Bound author of the Seinfeld Thread, who builds his own snowshoes
Troy, MT
USA
3140 Posts |
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Finally stopping that crazy suffering that is ice, climbing to concentrate on great ski tours!
3523 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 06:14 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Farmer
why not get one of these, and then just put the meals in a cheap plastic bag for storange and transport, and dump it in there for cooking / eating.
I haven't used a Fairshare mug, but I know lots of people that do, and I think I'm going to add it to my kit. There is a folding one, but the big lexan one looks better. Bulky to pack, but you could put stuff inside it when in the pack. |
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Vancouver, BC
Canada
1461 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 08:27 AM
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| Why not buy a few of the pre-made meals and reuse the pouch? They ought to last quite a while. |
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258 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 09:04 AM
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http://www.ziploc.com/Products/Pages/ZipSteamMicrowaveCookingBags.aspx
Something like this should work. They're a bit pricier than regular Ziploc bags, but are designed to handle hot water.
I haven't tried it yet though. If you're not in any rush, I will be cooking with a steam bag within the next few weeks...I can update this thread then if you like?
Although that mug does look handy... |
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Outward Bound author of the Seinfeld Thread, who builds his own snowshoes
Troy, MT
USA
3140 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 1:20 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by johngenx
quote:
Originally posted by Farmer
why not get one of these, and then just put the meals in a cheap plastic bag for storange and transport, and dump it in there for cooking / eating.
I haven't used a Fairshare mug, but I know lots of people that do, and I think I'm going to add it to my kit. There is a folding one, but the big lexan one looks better. Bulky to pack, but you could put stuff inside it when in the pack.
I got my fareshare mug about 5 years ago. They didn't have the collapseable ones back then. They do look like a great idea though, as the bulk is the biggest downside. I usually try to fill it with food though, to make use of the space. |
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511 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 4:41 PM
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I'm pretty sure plastic bags release chemicals when heated. I am not sure putting boiling water in any plastic is a good idea.The same goes for soup cans, many soup cans have a liner that when heated release chemicals.quote:
Originally posted by Rachelo
Note that ziplocs are often more robust than you think. Especially if you are looking for single-use. I have cooked chili and eggs and more with boiling water in ziplocs. Test them at home, and you might be pleasantly surprised.
Admittedly, they don't stand up on their own (though they are sealable so you don't need them standing, and can shake them around), and they don't insulate your hands from the heat very well (but make a lovely hand-warmer with a light pair of gloves).
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North Vancouver
178 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2011 : 4:57 PM
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| I agree with what paulyman said above. Plastics have a lot of nasty things that you probably don't want in your food, or body. I think titanium pots are the best option, although they are expensive. |
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North Vancouver, BC
Canada
1656 Posts |
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Qualicum Beach, BC
Canada
1332 Posts |
Posted - 03/06/2011 : 9:56 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by hafilax
Why not buy a few of the pre-made meals and reuse the pouch? They ought to last quite a while.
I save my old meal pouches and clean them up. With the reused pouches, I sometimes take pre-made meals, divide them up, then adding some of my own dried garden vege's, cheese, jerky, herbs & such, I can then customize my meals to the amounts I need and the taste I want.
Peter
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45 Posts |
Posted - 03/06/2011 : 10:39 PM
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| I think vacuum-sealer bags (foodsaver, etc.) are considered safe for boiling water/home-brew boil-in-bag meals. |
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Hope, BC
Canada
7131 Posts |
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Alberta-based choss climbin', flame throwin', rappel lovin', ass talkin' hater who doesn't like "Gumby" for a descriptor
6302 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2011 : 02:06 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Steventy
FWIW, the Ziploc site advises against boiling:
"# Can I boil in Ziploc® Brand Bags?
No. Ziploc® Brand Bags are not designed to withstand the extreme heat of boiling."
http://www.ziploc.com/Products/Pages/SandwichBags.aspx
It seems more as though the question is specific to using boil in the bag style such as what you get with some rice dishes. ...throw bag with food in it into a boiling pot of water.
Putting boiling water in to the bag to rehydrate and heat is not the same as throwing it in to a pot of boiling water and cooking is it?? Anyhow, the heavier freezer bags work very well and there is an entire website dedicated to it.
I do wonder about the chemical concern thing, although on their site they state they do not use BPA's and also states they are dioxin free....
quote:
All Ziploc® Brand Containers and microwaveable Ziploc® Brand Bags meet the safety requirements of the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) for temperatures associated with defrosting and reheating food in microwave ovens, as well as room, refrigerator, and freezer temperatures.
Like all Ziploc® Brand products, Zip’n Steam® Bags are dioxin free. Additionally, they are specially designed for microwave use and meet the safety requirements of the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) for temperatures associated with cooking food in the microwave when label directions are followed.
So what are the temps of reheating in the bag compared to pouring boiling water in them? |
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287 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 09:02 AM
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As mentioned above I wouldn't put Ziplocks in boiling water to cook something but I have had no problems pouring boiling water into the bag to rehydrate meals.
You can probably find a lot of info here:
http://www.trailcooking.com/ |
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93 Posts |
Posted - 03/15/2011 : 8:44 PM
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| Since steamer bags have a vent, I don't think I would use them for food storage. They aren't airtight. |
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canine loving, machete-toting bushwhacking lake seeker, Indiana Jones hat-wearing off-road 4x4 guru
Surrey Hole, BC
Canada
6871 Posts |
Posted - 03/15/2011 : 10:43 PM
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Not sure why people need to make things so complicated, if you are out for a night or 3, pack your favourite stuff, if you are a lazy cook like me, grab a premade pouch and or make do with just regular grub. At an average 6.95$ its tough to beat in time, $ and taste and nutrition.
Foil pouch stuff is for lazy people or serious backcountry people or climbers on the move..
Most hikers can carry good easy home made meals, or other easy available store meals, without having to get into special foil bags or other food prep.
Winter/spring/ fall travel does offer better food durability as far as fresh food.
Mid sumer can spoil (raw meat) food within hours.
From what I have seen, most people do seem to make some rather exceptional backcountry meals from basic home ingedients.
I still take a foil pouch on many trips, some are actually fairly good.
We have a dehydrator, but dont seem to use it much anymore, great for jerky though. |
Edited by - Aqua Terra on 03/16/2011 08:28 AM |
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Not too far from Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
224 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2011 : 10:12 AM
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Glad I stumbled across this thread, as I've been looking for ideas along this same line as well (mainly because I've found that run-of-the-mill instant side dishes - such as Knorr's "Sides", etc. - can be cooked simply by adding boiling water, and they are a lot cheaper than buying freeze-dried meals).
Anyhow, after reading up on Ziploc bags (which I agree are probably not ideal for putting boiling water in, especially when Ziploc states that "Ziploc® Zip’n Steam® Bags are NOT recommended for liquids or foods that require a lot of liquid [i.e., rice, soup or pasta]" http://www.ziploc.com/Products/Pages/ZipSteamMicrowaveCookingBags.aspx?SizeName=Medium and that all other "Ziploc® Brand Bags are not designed to withstand the extreme heat of boiling" http://www.ziploc.com/Products/Pages/FreezerBagsSmartZipSeal.aspx?SizeName=Gallon), I kept doing some more searching and came up with these: http://www.reynoldspkg.com/reynoldskitchens/en/product.asp?prod_id=3200.
I'm thinking that using one of these slow cooker bags to throw a meal's worth of dehydrated food/cheap side dishes into - along with the required amount of boiling water - would probably work pretty well (I'm also debating on using a lightweight, cheap-o insulated lunch bag to keep everything warm while it cooks). I'm guessing that the plastic must be safe and sturdy enough to put boiling water into (seeing as it's supposed to be used to line a slow cooker with), so I'm hoping that this will be a viable option....
Anyhow, I'm going to try to find some of these bags and give it a shot in the next few days, as I'd prefer to not have to clean up any pots, etc. while I'm backpacking (lazy, I know, but I hate cooking and doing dishes regardless of whether I am on the trail or at home  However, with that being said: I may see if there is a way to thoroughly clean out the bags when I get home so that I can get another use or two out of them; if not, then I'll probably have to reconsider this option at some point, seeing as I don't want to create any more garbage than is necessary....).
As an added bonus: if I only have to boil water in order to have a hot meal, then it means that I can continue to use my cat-food-can stove indefinitely - woohoo!! 
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Edited by - Hiking Solo on 08/08/2011 10:17 AM |
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Port Moody, BC
Canada
261 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2011 : 10:58 AM
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Assuming your freeze-dried/dehydrated meals are already cooked before packaging then the goal is really to rehydrate and warm the food to make it palatable. One of those GSI type mugs is all you need. Put a meal in the container and add water at last break before reaching camp and by the time your setup the food is already hydrated. All you need to do is drain and add hot water to warm it up. Even several of the current Nalgene's look to be rated up to boiling water temps.
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Foil-pouch meals
