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Maple Ridge, BC
Canada
79 Posts |
Posted - 07/23/2009 : 04:54 AM
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Hey everyone. I was just wondering, I just read a report from I think it was "october" of 2008, just last year, I read something about ski runs being placed on the following glaciers (for year round skiiing) for the jumbo glacier resort that is to be completed. I don't know if they have the approval to go ahead with this resort......
The glaciers are farnham, jumbo, commander and glacier dome glaciers. I thought you could see this scar upon the wilderness from only the jumbo pass hike! But I have a book on hikes in the east kootenays. I think there's two. And the farnham glacier I KNOW you can see from a hike that is in one of those books. From just how many hikes are you going to be able to see this dumb resort??? Can anyone please explain to me? I'd really like to know because whatever hikes are gonna be disgraced if you share my feelings, those are the hikes that I need to do quick! Anyway, thanks alot. Thanks for any replies. Bye! |
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Salmon Arm, BC
Canada
900 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 12:12 PM
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Hi Rambler. From what I know, there is still not approval for Jumbo Resort.
But yes you're right about those glaciers, and yes there will be an impact--on other recreationists as well as on grizzlies etc.--and many locals are opposed to the development.
Perversely, one of the plans the developers put forward at one time to mitigate the impact on the grizzly bear was to close off some areas--specifically the Jumbo Pass trail! Nice impact on the hiking community, eh!! Well, that went over like a lead balloon and they have backed off from that part of the plan, but they are still pushing their development.
Here is the developer's website: http://www.jumboglacierresort.com/ Click on the master plan to view the details and maps.
And here is the opponent's website: http://www.keepitwild.ca/
Yes you would see the development from the Farnham Creek trail, as they plan a day lodge at the forks plus lifts and runs in both upper valleys. From LOTHG (Lake of the Hanging Glacier) you might see the top tower on Glacier Dome and probably a good portion of the chair on Jumbo Glacier. Maybe not so much from the lake outlet, but definitely if you scramble up above the lake towards Glacier Dome you'd see the Jumbo Glacier chair. |
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 | Dru
Mountain Grammar Police
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 Sardonic sandbagging scoundrel, Cascade Climbers lobotomized spraymeister, space blanket flyer, new millennium vulgarian betaboy and friend to all squids
Climbing, a mountain
Canada
∞ Posts |
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vancouver, bc
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 10:36 AM
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Wow, more backroom dealings and approvals despite significant public protest, in what way is this decision democratic and serving of these jackass politician's constituants.
Decisions like this just makes me cringe, B.C is such a special place in Canada and the world, if we keep liquidating our assets like this, unable to protect even the most prized areas, then what hope do we have for preserving like areas for future generations use and enjoyment. We don't want or need gondolas to take us to our mountains, the result is just so detrimental to the overall aesthetic and experience, you might as well just turn it into a nuclear test range, f$%k! |
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Vancouver, BC
Canada
278 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 11:54 AM
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Sunshine Coast, BC
Canada
257 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 4:13 PM
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Jumbo Pass is our top-of-the-list place for rocky mountain hikes. We've been going there every year in September for some time and have a trip report or two about it, here on CT. The hike to Jumbo Pass is delightful, a few hours in a steady climb to brilliant high-elevation meadows and stands of Western larch/spruce below Bastille Mtn. absolutely adore the place and yearn for it all winter long.
Be that as it may, there's a fair bit of hoo-hoo about the area, saying it's pristine, untouched, unrivaled and so on. That is just not true, the area has been logged and mined for decades. That's how we access the Jumbo pass trail head, on logging and mining roads. While I'm not opposed to good resort projects or constrained industrial development, this project makes little sense.
Jumbo Valley is a long way from a major center. I just can't see the resort getting much use, owing to the burdensome drive to get there. Panorama is not exactly heavily used, why another resort even with a 'glacier' focus, in the same area?
If any investor looks at the economics, with an objective view, they'd run from it, and hopefully they will.
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Vancouver
Canada
291 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 4:42 PM
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"Once complete, it will feature up to 23 lifts, a 3,000-metre-high gondola and a ski village with more than 6,000 units. The resort will be comparable in size to Silver Star in Vernon, B.C. — or about 1/10th the size of Whistler Blackcomb"
???
23 lifts on a mountain the size of Silver Star? Or >50% of Whistler's lifts and 10% its terrain? |
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Kootenay Bud
2695 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 5:44 PM
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If you've been there, you know the logging, mining is not as extensive as the developer would have you believe. And, the area has one of the biggest and healthiest populations of grizzly bears left in BC. You'd also know that skiing on that glacier in summer is a joke. What isn't flat is heavily crevassed. And, not to nitpick, but it's the Purcells, not the Rockies. The Purcells are part of the Columbias.
It's a hell of a shame. There is a big concentration of 11,000 foot peaks there, all great climbs, but, most to be ruined by this development.
360 degree view with ten 11,000 foot peaks taken from Karnak. Looks pretty wild to me. |
Edited by - sandy on 03/20/2012 5:45 PM |
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Maple Ridge, BC
Canada
780 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 6:25 PM
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Sandy, do you have a larger version of that hosted elsewhere, I'd really love a closer look?
Thanks,
Karen |
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Whistler, BC
Canada
54 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 6:25 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by xj6response
Jumbo Valley is a long way from a major center. I just can't see the resort getting much use, owing to the burdensome drive to get there. Panorama is not exactly heavily used, why another resort even with a 'glacier' focus, in the same area?
If any investor looks at the economics, with an objective view, they'd run from it, and hopefully they will.
One just has to look at Revelstoke for the evidence to back the above post up. The distance from a major airport is also a drawback. Unfortunately stupid investors are everywhere and all they'll need is a slick talking sales guy to lure them in. That's probably the reason they're looking in France - hoping to find someone who does not understand the NA ski market.
I also don't understand how they think a year-round ski resort will pay it's bills in the summer months? Whistler usually has enough snow to stay open until July, but closes in late May (with one of the mountains closing in April) because no one is thinking of skiing any more at that point. The only reason they run the glacier skiing at all in the summer is for the park rat camps.
BTW, Panorama's skiing sucks. Does anyone know what the terrain at Jumbo will be like? Is it steep or is it more intermediate in nature? |
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Sunshine Coast, BC
Canada
257 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 6:36 PM
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Gotta say, in the many years we've been going to Jumbo valley, I never stop marveling at the beauty of the place. However, it really has been extensively worked in. In the background of the trail head sign below, you can see one of the many regenerated clear cuts in the valley. Fortunately, regeneration has been reasonably prolific so much of the denudation has recovered, but a lot of the valley bottom, and much of the accessible side hill timber has been taken. Nonetheless, that is not a justification for more development. Even though I'm a skier, am thankful for ski hills, this project is silly. I really can't believe major money will come into it.
Still, the truth is the truth and that is Jumbo Valley is in no way pristine, untouched wilderness. It's beautiful, it's great wildlife habitat (even after all that logging and mining) and it's still the best access to beautiful sub-alpine terrain west of the Rocky mountain trench, but it's by no means virginal landscape.
regenerated clearcut in background of trailhead sign, Actually, the trailhead sits in the middle of a seriously large, old cut block
regenerated clearcuts in the background, with over grown skid trails visible, and ugly skidder-logged patches up the side hills
view of Jumbo Valley, regenerated cutblocks up the sides of mountains in the back ground
Google earth image, views of cutblocks, mining activity |
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Whistler, BC
Canada
54 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 6:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Coastal
23 lifts on a mountain the size of Silver Star? Or >50% of Whistler's lifts and 10% its terrain?
"Once complete", W/B will have 50% more lifts than it does now according to it's master plan... ;)
Jumbo will be lucky to get enough capital together to build the gondola and a couple of chairs. Funding for further lifts will dry up once the place is operational and everyone realizes it's a flop just like Revy is. At least Revy is owned by one super-rich guy who can keep throwing money at it.
IMO the province should be demanding a few million dollars be deposited into a trust to pay for the restoration of the area once the place folds. |
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Kootenay Bud
2695 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 7:20 PM
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One of my buddies who is a biologist who has been involved in the anti-Jumbo movement says "cutblocks regenerate, parking lots don't".
High res pic of the area hosted on Bivouac. |
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Invermere, BC
Canada
177 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 7:42 PM
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Have to step in and defend Panorama here haha. Yes we locals joke about the donut but the terrain is fantastic and the snow the past couple years has been great.
http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vimeo.com%2Fm%2F38347844&h=YAQHUEFeSAQFiRQxB9mq4Y80WHud37CsrvJ8xgC3VprfrZQ
As for Jumbo - the skiing is great as it is currently heli-skiing terrain and accessible to some degree to ski touring. That being said, I'm not sure I see the viability of the project given its location, the access road, current ski hill economics etc not to mention native groups that dont agree and environmental concerns. No it is not virgin, but not much is completely untouched anymore. It has come back in a big way from the mining and logging that took place decades ago. Very little of that is going on these days. |
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Sunshine Coast, BC
Canada
257 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 8:09 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Good News Bear
quote:
Originally posted by Coastal
23 lifts on a mountain the size of Silver Star? Or >50% of Whistler's lifts and 10% its terrain?
"Once complete", W/B will have 50% more lifts than it does now according to it's master plan... ;)
Jumbo will be lucky to get enough capital together to build the gondola and a couple of chairs. Funding for further lifts will dry up once the place is operational and everyone realizes it's a flop just like Revy is. At least Revy is owned by one super-rich guy who can keep throwing money at it.
IMO the province should be demanding a few million dollars be deposited into a trust to pay for the restoration of the area once the place folds.
spot on, this project is nuts. It's likely to be a grotesque white elephant, in an area that should just be left to its own devices. The old cutblocks are regenerating very well, for the most part. The wildlife is abundant. The surrounding high country is world class and the notion this resort can thrive is a long-shot at best. Hopefully, it just won't happen. Here's some more pics, kind of why I go back there every september.
Mt. Bastille, in all its glory
butterfly in meadow at 7200' level
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| gyppo
Intermediate Member
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Edmonton, AB
Canada
753 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 8:24 PM
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Nice to know that letter I wrote 2 years ago was thrown in the garbage.
Bullshit. Squamish gondola.. jasper glacier walk..now jumbo resort... total bullshit.
B |
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| gyppo
Intermediate Member
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Edmonton, AB
Canada
753 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 8:29 PM
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quote:
I also don't understand how they think a year-round ski resort will pay it's bills in the summer months?
I'm guessing the same bull they spew out all the time: a four-season resort with hotels, fine dining, a golf course, mountain biking and hiking trails and interpretive glacier walks. Maybe a restaurant that sells locally produced organic vegan raw food (nothing against vegans, I just hate the way people use this as a sales pitch). Maybe a grizzly bear enclosure the size of your average back yard, logging shows, a fucking souvenir stand, shit... I feel sick.
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Happy go lucky, plaid wearin, postholin, safeway gaitor sportin, old-school film shootin, giver of many regards
Abbotsford, B.C.
Canada
13599 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 8:48 PM
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Key point here is the economics, i.e. project viability. It almost seems the politicians backing this have glossed over eyes in extolling the virtues of year round glacier skiing. World wide - investor confidence is just coming back, but subject to a lot of scares;European debit crisis, Greece, China, etc......
This project won't get far if they are relying on a pool of investors.
K |
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Richmond, BC
Canada
2473 Posts |
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3022 Posts |
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North Vancouver, BC
Canada
1657 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2012 : 01:20 AM
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I've taken a look and I don't think that this project proponent will work productively with the community of recreational users. I won't be surprised if we aren't even allowed to park overnight.
Some interesting quotes below.
http://www.newsroom.gov.bc.ca/2012/03/jumbo-glacier-resort-approved.html
"* The minister approved the Master Development Agreement under the Land Act and Ministry of Lands, Parks and Housing Act.
Master Plan:
http://www.for.gov.bc.ca/ftp/resort_development/external/!publish/web/resort_plans/approved/Jumbo/JGR-MP_2010.pdf
pg 115:
"Some have expressed the notion that "anyone, with a little effort, can currently ski Jumbo Glacier for free," but reality simply does not bear out this argument.
The majority of Canadians do not have the skill, training, physical capability, equipment and budget to undertake such expeditions. The proponent is not aware of anyone who has recently successfully accessed the top of Jumbo or Commander Glaciers and skied them without expensive mechanized assistance (ie. helicopter). The experience of these locations remains the exclusive domain of the privileged few."
They then go on to list the costs and equipment for an ACC trip to the Mt. Waddington area to show how expensive and unreasonable it is to access these areas without mechanized lifts.
pg 116.
"Unlike ski touring, which has a large number of excellent areas available for prime touring experiences for those people who have the ability to practice the sport, the proposed project will open the ONLY area available today in North America for helicopter quality skiing without the helicopter, but by means of ski lifts. It is noteworthy that in the last twenty years project opponents have not been able to identify an alternative location where this project could be done."
pg 372:
"Resort guests are not expected to go hiking into the wilderness. The project is not planned for this clientele and is specifically designed to counter any interests in such activities which are unnecessary for the enjoyment of the mountains and for the skiing experience and which only create uncontrollable hazards and liabilities."
pg 373:
"The resort will not facilitate and will actively discourage hiking outside the marked trail." |
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About jumbo glacier resort
