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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/02/2009 : 10:50 AM
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Heyla, folks...
I introduced myself as a writer and researcher who, though living near some wonderful wetlands, loves the mountains, here.
http://www.clubtread.com/sforum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=30834
Also posted some questions I had about some scenarios I'm working on. It generated some great and useful information. Per the request of the moderators, I'm splitting my original thread up and shifting it from Trip Reports to Discussions. I'm including the same intro with each thread, so ya'll will probably get tired of reading it. (You can skip ahead to the bolded sequence description.)
If it seems, to those who have been kind enough to offer their knowledge and opinions like I am juggling quite a few scenarios, I am. One book finished, second one almost finished, and about 40% of each of 10 others written. For me, writing means juggling dozens of scenes and seeing which ones fall into place, where. Bit like looking at a map and planning a long hike... you have the map. You know a trail goes from here to here. You know there are certain key places, such as camp sites, river crossings, a scramble or two. But what you find when you actually make the hike may not match what you thought you were going to find, and it may be completely different from what anyone else who has hiked this trail before you has found. What will the weather be like? What wild life will you encounter? How about that river crossing? Or will you find yourself crossing the same river a dozen times, and then decide to bushwhack along the bank?
Writing fiction, for me, is much like that. I have this Image of people in a given location. From that comes Who are they? Why are they in this location? What are they doing? And how does it advance the overall story line?
One of the things I really appreciate about reading your trip reports is the symmetry of having description and pictures. I can Google "XYZ Location" and get hundreds, if not thousands of images. But they're not in context. I don't know what else is around that one time snapshot. Even if I weren't researching with specific goals in mind (and I did find ClubTread via a Goggle search), I would have lost myself in enjoyment. I truly want to thank everyone who has already contributed to this thread, and its parent thread. Having the input of people who know these beautiful mountains intimately is a wonderful help.
-- Marilynx
Sequence 1: Experienced hiker, with 25 years of hiking and scrambling experience, plenty of weekends in the Four Corners states (Colorado, New Mexico, Arizona, Utah), but also including the Pacific Crest Trail and the Appalachian Trail. She's done an assortment of 3500 to 4000 meter climbs in Colorado, as well as the Colorado Trail and the Arizona Trail, not to mention Mount Rainier. Several very challenging trails in the Sierra Nevadas, Sierra Madres and Grand Tetons. However, this is her first venture into Canada. Scene opens with her coming up from Shadow Lake through Gibbon Pass, past the Twin Lakes heading for Arnica Lake. The actual sequence on Gibbon Pass, etc. occurs on 20 July. This is the end of a very long hike, from Yellowstone Park in Wyoming.
Rachelo said: That sure is a long hike! Is there a question here? Or maybe you will have questions on it later. for now, I can offer you a photographic tour of that very trip. We were ~2 weeks behind that date, but this might still help. http://littlehost.no-ip.org/~rachelo/hiking/html/trip_reports/089-bow_valley_highline_2-summer_2007.html
Marilynx said: Very long hike. And that is a wonderful collection of photos, which gives me a better idea of what's actually there.
Yes, actually, I do have some questions. Bearing in mind that I do know one doesn't collect plants in a National Park, what, if any, edible plants might one find over Gibbon Pass and starting down toward the lakes? (The problem with something like Edible Plants of the Rocky Mountains and Handbook of the Canadian Rockies is that while they are chock full of useful information, it's hard to calculate what may be available in a specific location.)
Second, is there a place along that trail where it switchbacks up a steep rise. Was thinking of a couple descriptions of the area between the Lower lake and Arnica, which implied a fairly steep rise?
What I need for purposes of the story is that the POV (point of view) character has been injured and is keeping going by sheer determination. (Yeah, it's another one of those "can't call the authorities for help... 'cept in this case, the reader will encounter this sequence before the Death Trap sequence -- they're in two different books).
She's working her way up a steep incline. The path ahead of her hair-pins and comes back essentially at her shoulder height. She pauses to catch her breath, closing her eyes for a moment. Opens her eyes, and she's looking at a pair of hiking boots that weren't there a moment before. And she had no idea there was anyone else around for a whole bunch of kilometers.
I really, REALLY need this scene. I read every hike description between Banff and Lake Louise in every book I could find trying to find something that would give me this, and the only place which seemed like it might was this route, Gibbon Pass to Hwy 93.
Rachelo said: I don't actually know what is edible. We saw a ton of Arnica, lots of Indian Paintbrush, and a couple other flowers. If you're thinking of specific plants i might be able to tell you whether we'd seen them.
Basically.... no. This (the scenario Marilynx described) simply does not exist. While it is a moderately steep rise, it is short enough that there isn't really anything intense. This is the ascent between them.
Could your sequence possibly work if she was going downhill? Once you pass Arnica Lake and head down, it's a brutal, steep, knee-crushing descent to Vista Lake. In this photo, (fullsize it for better viewing) you are headed for the small-lookiing lake, and then have to ascend to the clearing shown above it, where there is a parking lot on highway 93. Or, if you could do a steep uphilll without the switchback, you could put it between Twin and Arnica Lakes, or between Vista Lake and the highway.
Marilynx said: I'll have to fish out the two references I have and come up with a few specific plants to see if they might grow there.
http://www.canrockbooks.com/?page=shop/browse&category_id=20 is, btw, a nice listing of books on wild flowers -- I've seen several trip reports with really lovely shots of different plants and a caption of "Not sure what it is..." The link might be useful to someone hunting a guide.
Argh. (Nice pictures, btw.... I've been in the parking lot on 93, both summer and winter, and thought it looked like a gosh-awful long way down to Vista, and that I wouldn't like to be climbing up from Vista at the end of a hike.)
OK, I have two options, then. One is to leave the scene as it stands, and put in an end note telling people that there really isn't a switch-back on this trail. (The probability is that the majority of people who might read the book won't ever hike this trail and won't know the difference.)
Trouble is, I'm enough of a detailist that I hate cheating that way. Let's try this from another angle. Given how steep the trail is down to Vista and back up to the parking lot, is there a possibility that someone, at some point in the future, might modify the trail to have a switch back, making it less steep? Or is there any place along the track from the Twin Lakes to Arnica which could benefit from a switchback?
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Edited by - Marilynx on 06/04/2009 1:53 PM
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Calgary, Alberta
Andorra
3830 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2009 : 12:06 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Marilynx
Argh. (Nice pictures, btw.... I've been in the parking lot on 93, both summer and winter, and thought it looked like a gosh-awful long way down to Vista, and that I wouldn't like to be climbing up from Vista at the end of a hike.)
You're right. I sure didn't like climbing back up from Vista. I cam't believe people that go to Arnica/Twin Lakes for a day trip. The section of trail between Arnica Lake and highway 93 was by far the worst part of the trip for me. Although after the descent of pain, this ascent actually went far more quickly than expected.
quote:
Originally posted by Marilynx
Let's try this from another angle. Given how steep the trail is down to Vista and back up to the parking lot, is there a possibility that someone, at some point in the future, might modify the trail to have a switch back, making it less steep? Or is there any place along the track from the Twin Lakes to Arnica which could benefit from a switchback?
While I remember a steady one-way ascent back to the highway, I think it would be entirely plausible that a switchback existed. If you told me there was one now, I wouldn't be able to say for 100% that you were wrong, and it would definitely be possible for the trail to be modified in this way. I would put in a switchback here though long before I would between the lakes. |
Edited by - Rachelo on 06/03/2009 12:06 AM |
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Salmon Arm, BC
Canada
900 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2009 : 1:23 PM
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Hi Marilynx (I like that moniker!) and Rachelo. There are several switchbacks in the upper part of the old burn below Arnica Lake. That is my fave part of this hike--coming down on a sunny fall afternoon, with the golden larches and scarlet huckleberries, and having your views ahead alternate between Castle Mtn and Boom Lake as you descend through the turns. Marvelous!
Yes, I'm one of those guys who actually quite enjoyed a day hike to Arnica and Twin Lakes. I actually made it to Gibbon Pass and back. Had the trail all to myself except for one team of horses.
Marilynx, you should know that the most prominent feature of this hike is the huge north face of Storm Mtn, it looms over all 3 lakes and the whole stretch of trail. And when you're coming from Vermilion Pass/Vista trailhead, you cross over a small ridge just before Arnica Lake (some views of Bow Valley), while the trail from Arnica to Twin Lakes is entirely in the forest.
Hope this helps!! |
Edited by - pmjwright on 06/03/2009 1:24 PM |
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2009 : 1:53 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by pmjwright
Hi Marilynx (I like that moniker!) and Rachelo. There are several switchbacks in the upper part of the old burn below Arnica Lake. That is my fave part of this hike--coming down on a sunny fall afternoon, with the golden larches and scarlet huckleberries, and having your views ahead alternate between Castle Mtn and Boom Lake as you descend through the turns. Marvelous!
Heh. The moniker actually derived from a tyop, er, typo. Someone was typing my name in a real-time conference, and typed an "x" instead of a comma after it. I decided I liked it, and so use it for anything connected to the out doors. Lynxes are interesting critters.
Now, just to be sure I have the visualization clear -- keeping in mind that I have the descriptions from Graeme Pole's Classic Hikes and a couple of others (Patton?) which have disappeared in my piles of books, and Rachelo's grand pictures -- are you speaking of switchbacks coming from which direction? From Hwy 93 to Gibbon Pass, or on the return? And are they between the Twin Lakes and Arnica, or between Arnica and Vista?
quote:
Originally posted by pmjwright
Yes, I'm one of those guys who actually quite enjoyed a day hike to Arnica and Twin Lakes. I actually made it to Gibbon Pass and back. Had the trail all to myself except for one team of horses.
You have no concept of how much I envy you and the others posting trail reports here. I love the mountains, and I used to like hiking, but am no longer able to. Where do the horses come from? Were they privately owned, or a tour?
quote:
Originally posted by pmjwright
Marilynx, you should know that the most prominent feature of this hike is the huge north face of Storm Mtn, it looms over all 3 lakes and the whole stretch of trail. And when you're coming from Vermilion Pass/Vista trailhead, you cross over a small ridge just before Arnica Lake (some views of Bow Valley), while the trail from Arnica to Twin Lakes is entirely in the forest. Hope this helps!!
I do have some photographs of it, and I also understand it can be a bit of a weather predictor -- if clouds start gathering around it, bad weather is in store! Hence the name.
The character is coming from Gibbon Pass towards Hwy 93. She'd be enjoying it quite a bit more if her foot wasn't broken. (I have a beta reader who's an MD who read this sequence and told me just how much I could get away with doing to her.) My intention was to have her going UP a switchback, pause, facing the upper switch, then realize she's not alone on the trail, because someone is standing there, and she's looking at a pair of boots. Which startles her, because it makes her realize just how out of it she is, which is a Bad Thing in a Wild Zone.
If the switchback you remember is going down, it may be possible to reverse the sequence... which might work even better. Going downhill can, in some cases, put more stress on the body than going uphill.
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2009 : 2:14 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Rachelo
You're right. I sure didn't like climbing back up from Vista. I cam't believe people that go to Arnica/Twin Lakes for a day trip. The section of trail between Arnica Lake and highway 93 was by far the worst part of the trip for me. Although after the descent of pain, this ascent actually went far more quickly than expected.
In 2004, I tried to figure out if it was feasible to come up Red Earth to Shadow Lake, then out over Gibbon Pass to 93. I concluded, to my regret, that it just wasn't in the cards.
Do you find, as I mentioned to pmjwright, that going down hill can almost be worse than going up hill?
 As for the last ascent, well, the end was in sight! Both a Good Thing, because you're tired, and a Bad Thing because this part of this adventure is over.
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While I remember a steady one-way ascent back to the highway, I think it would be entirely plausible that a switchback existed. If you told me there was one now, I wouldn't be able to say for 100% that you were wrong, and it would definitely be possible for the trail to be modified in this way. I would put in a switchback here though long before I would between the lakes.
I can see that. I'm now mentally juggling the scenario, and trying to figure what exactly would be seeable in that area. I could fudge a bit if in deep forest, but between Storm Mountain at her back and Castle Mountain across the way, it's something to be considered.
I know that her intent, if she hadn't met the individual she dubs "Ranger-boots," would have been to continue across to the Boom Lake Trail, and then to the Panorama Ridge Trail, but fortunately for her and her broken foot, it wasn't necessary. (And yes, she doesn't want any thing to do with the local guv'mint, either, though they aren't specifically looking for her.)
Still trying to find my references so I can ask about edibles on this trail (keeping in mind that if this were not fiction, one would not be foraging in a national park). <grin> Sorry if I keep repeating this, but as sure as I don't, someone will come along and have a canary over the idea of such foraging.
I had a chance to read some of the CAJs in Banff when I was there, and my more modern brain tilted at the recommendations to chop down pine boughs to make a bed on.
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Calgary, Alberta
Andorra
3830 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2009 : 4:00 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by pmjwright
There are several switchbacks in the upper part of the old burn below Arnica Lake. That is my fave part of this hike--coming down on a sunny fall afternoon, with the golden larches and scarlet huckleberries, and having your views ahead alternate between Castle Mtn and Boom Lake as you descend through the turns. Marvelous!
This burn area is between Arnica and Vista lakes. Therefore, on the descent, not either of the ascents.
If you're willing to adjust it a little to be going up instead of down, I would suggest it as an excellent option. Though pmjwright finds it nice, with the large packs, I definitely found it a crushing descent. A broken foot would make it quite worse. And not only are there some tight switchbacks, but below the views it goes into fairly close forest where it would be easy to come around a corner and see things. |
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2009 : 8:10 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Rachelo
This burn area is between Arnica and Vista lakes. Therefore, on the descent, not either of the ascents. If you're willing to adjust it a little to be going up instead of down, I would suggest it as an excellent option. Though pmjwright finds it nice, with the large packs, I definitely found it a crushing descent. A broken foot would make it quite worse. And not only are there some tight switchbacks, but below the views it goes into fairly close forest where it would be easy to come around a corner and see things.
Is the burn area you're speaking of the remnants of the 1968 Vermillion Pass fire? Since my tale is set in 2149, I think it's a safe bet that it's well-grown over. (Which is not to say that another fire might not have devastated the area....)
Your comment "If you're willing to adjust it a little to be going up instead of down," confuses me, since that's what my original scenario is -- character is going up, person she meets is above her on the switchback. Yet in the next sentence, you're speaking of descents. Perhaps I'm misunderstanding?
Character has a pretty light pack: when her foot was broken/crushed, she knew she couldn't continue with her full pack, so slung it up a tree and brought with her only those items she considered essential to survival.
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Salmon Arm, BC
Canada
900 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 08:39 AM
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Hi Marilynx. I think Rachelo answered a couple of your questions re the switchbacks--they are between Arnica and Vista, mainly just west of Arnica. So they're on the downhill. I don't recall any switchbacks between Vista and the highway.
So let's work on the others:
Horses--they were a tour, but only 2 people (guide and client), with 4 horses in total. Horses are allowed to use the trail from Vermilion Pass to Twin Lakes; beyond there, I'm not sure about, but I think they can use it to Shadow Lake.
As for fires, yes the trail passes through the 1968 Vermilion Pass fire. Some areas have regenerated well with young lodgepole pines, while other areas are still quite open, with lots of huckleberry bushes etc. So, it is possible that the burn could be mature forest by the date of your story. But these pine forests burn every 150 years or so, so you could use any kind of scenario for the nature of the forest in the vicinity of your story. For instance, there was a major fire in 2003 (actually 2 or 3 fires that converged into one) that burned all the way from the edge of this old burn through Marble Canyon all the way to the Floe Lake trail and Vermilion Crossing. And with global warming, there could be more fires than in the past. Anyways, just helps give you some flexibility. |
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 12:03 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by pmjwright
Hi Marilynx. I think Rachelo answered a couple of your questions re the switchbacks--they are between Arnica and Vista, mainly just west of Arnica. So they're on the downhill. I don't recall any switchbacks between Vista and the highway.
OK, so going down, not coming up. Now to decide which is worse on a character with a broken foot. Elevation loss or elevation gain. <wry grin>
quote:
Originally posted by pmjwright
Horses--they were a tour, but only 2 people (guide and client), with 4 horses in total. Horses are allowed to use the trail from Vermilion Pass to Twin Lakes; beyond there, I'm not sure about, but I think they can use it to Shadow Lake.
Interesting. I haven't scene anything like that on any of the websites I've perused... they're all large groups. And the areas they were going, I wasn't interested in. This is a possibility to pursue the next time I'm up there. Got handed a new health challenge last autumn: complex sleep disordered breathing. Highly treatable, but my bleeping Bipap Auto SV is four pounds (1.82 kg) while the battery for a single overnight with it is 13 pounds (5.9 kg), which add up to rather more than I'd care to be hauling, in addition to the rest of a standard pack. I know there are other hoseheads who go car camping, but where I want to go isn't accessible by car.
quote:
As for fires, yes the trail passes through the 1968 Vermilion Pass fire. Some areas have regenerated well with young lodgepole pines, while other areas are still quite open, with lots of huckleberry bushes etc. So, it is possible that the burn could be mature forest by the date of your story. But these pine forests burn every 150 years or so, so you could use any kind of scenario for the nature of the forest in the vicinity of your story. For instance, there was a major fire in 2003 (actually 2 or 3 fires that converged into one) that burned all the way from the edge of this old burn through Marble Canyon all the way to the Floe Lake trail and Vermilion Crossing. And with global warming, there could be more fires than in the past. Anyways, just helps give you some flexibility.
Huckleberry bushes are of interest. Rachelo didn't know of any edible plants across Gibbon Pass and down to the Twin Lakes. (Again specifying that I know one doesn't forage in a national park today.)Then again, on her hike, she wasn't looking for any, since she wasn't anticipating that a crazy writer would come along and quiz her about the area! I haven't had a chance to forage <g> in my book boxes for a couple of my references to look up the plants I thought might be there. Thinking of greenery, berries, possibly some tubers, maybe cat-tails near the marshy areas of the lakes? Time is 20 July, as that can make a difference. I get into hassles with this regularly. I read a trail description which says, "In summer, blah, blah, blah will be seen..." and I want to scream. SUMMER defined HOW? Early summer? High summer? Late summer? Summer as defined in Banff, Lake Louise, or Jasper? Summer in the valleys? Summer above the treeline?
Actually, haven't decided if global warming is a factor in the time period I'm writing in. We solved the energy crisis (don't I wish!) and for all I know, some of the glaciers may be growing again. I remember looking at the markers at the Athabasca Glacier for where it was in 1907 (one of the years I'm interested in) and where it is now. I cannot remember where it was in 1835, another Important Year for my writing.
As much as forest fires are a concern, they're part of the cycle of the forest. So I can either have the area mature forest, or recently burned over. Mature forest is probably my better bet for the moment, though if I need something dramatic later on, I can always burn Vermillion Pass again, though I think I had fires over in Yoho mentioned in passing. Don't want to burn TOO much of the area in one summer!
And besides, the POV (point of view) character is still enroute to the location where most of the action takes place. Don't want to burn the place down before she gets there!
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Calgary, Alberta
Andorra
3830 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 3:15 PM
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Can't rule out the burns though. EVERYTHING burned in the summer of 2003. The city of Calgary was periodically smoky and had dim red sunsets for the month of August. They shut down large sections of the wilderness where they were afraid that if someone brushed against a tree the friction would ignite it and burn down another whole valley. If you want to burn down the entire place, you have precedent.
There are some neat areas just down highway 93 where you can see the new growth and standing deadwood from the fire of '68 right beside the recent char and fireweed from the fire of '03.
As for my confusing statement, that's just my brain and my editing failing. I did mean to go down instead of up.
I actually do look for plants and have some pictures and such, and have a good idea of what's there - I just don't know what is edible of what is there. that's something I've never studied.
The photos I pointed you to are from the second week of august, 2007. I'm not sure whether it would be marshy enough anywhere for cattails. |
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 3:58 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Rachelo
Can't rule out the burns though. EVERYTHING burned in the summer of 2003. The city of Calgary was periodically smoky and had dim red sunsets for the month of August. They shut down large sections of the wilderness where they were afraid that if someone brushed against a tree the friction would ignite it and burn down another whole valley. If you want to burn down the entire place, you have precedent. There are some neat areas just down highway 93 where you can see the new growth and standing deadwood from the fire of '68 right beside the recent char and fireweed from the fire of '03.
Well, at the moment I don't have any reason to burn everything down... although you may start percolating Images in my brain. And anyone who knows me well knows that the cry of "I have this Image..." is the precursor to frantic research, much swearing, and WAY too many nights without sleep as I try to figure out how the pieces of the puzzle go together. (Oh, and much cursing on the part of my co-author, who is obliged to work her day job instead of answer emails.)
We did drive down 93, both winter and summer of 2004. That area that burned was especially stark in February, and not much more recovered come late June.
I had wanted to get a good shot of the full moon rising near Fairview (from the Lake Louise shore). Planned both my visits to be there for the full moon. It snowed like the blazes the entire time of the full moon in February. When we drove into the park in June, the high alert fire signs were every where. So, when I missed my full moon shots yet again because it had clouded over, and was raining for three days, I could hardly argue. What's a photograph against needed snow or rain? (Still want that photo, though....)
quote:
As for my confusing statement, that's just my brain and my editing failing. I did mean to go down instead of up.
That's fine. I was perfectly willing to believe it was my brain unhinged and not properly understanding what you were saying. "Space... the final frontier... it's in between my ears!"
quote:
I actually do look for plants and have some pictures and such, and have a good idea of what's there - I just don't know what is edible of what is there. That's something I've never studied.
It's the history buff in me... I want to know what people could live on if they didn't have packs of Ramen noodles and so forth.
I've been browsing through the rest of your photos, and did notice the plant shots. I assume you're familiar with this book?
http://www.canrockbooks.com/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=271&CLSN_553=1240669205553d2faaf054e98d2e9096
It's the one I've gone and put in a SAFE place, so I can't thumb through it to ask you if you saw any of the items I might have had in mind.
quote:
The photos I pointed you to are from the second week of august, 2007. I'm not sure whether it would be marshy enough anywhere for cattails.
Hmm, I guess living in Flatland with too many wetlands around me has me assuming "marsh" anywhere there's water. Looked like the shallow edges of some of the lakes, with the grasses and such nearby might have been marshy.
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Salmon Arm, BC
Canada
900 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 4:03 PM
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Hi Marilynx.
Regarding your Athabasca Glacier research for 1835--the earliest travelers basically couldn't follow the current Parkway route because the glacier filled the valley. Instead, they detoured via Wilcox Pass. A quick Google search came up with the following quote:
quote:
In 1896 Walter Wilcox, Robert L. Barrett and guides Tom Lusk and Fred Stephens travelled north over Bow Pass, up the Saskatchewan River and became the first to reach Sunwapta Pass. They were on a sixty day expedition and searching for a pass through which to reach the Athabasca River. Impressed by, the tremendous grandeur of mountain scenery, the group explored the area, Barrett even attempting to climb, a beautiful, glacier-hung peak which must have been Mount Athabasca.
In order to determine if the party could continue over the newly discovered pass, Fred Stephens was able to pass between the toe of the Athabasca Glacier and the steep slopes of Mount Wilcox, but found that, the route which first appeared most promising was blocked by a canyon. The party then proceeded over a high grassy pass to the east of what is now known as Mount Wilcox descending into the Sunwapta Valley beyond Tangle Falls and the steep canyon to continue their explorations. The pass was later named in honour of Walter Wilcox.
Glaciologists believe the Little Ice Age ended (actually it peaked) around 1850. For Athabasca, it was thought to be 1843-44. The glacier had receded about 200 metres and the toe was about 120 metres thinner by the time the earliest photos were taken in 1906. What the earliest travelers saw in 1896 or 1907 was a glacier already in recession. By the way, the toes of Dome and Athabasca Glaciers actually merged together during the glacial maximum. A fictional traveler would probably have had to cross the glacier toe or sidehill along Mt Wilcox at about the present site of the Chalet.
Check out this link for a study of those earliest photos and info on the glacial maximum: http://www.erudit.org/revue/gpq/1999/v53/n3/004844ar.pdf
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Edited by - pmjwright on 06/04/2009 4:30 PM |
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 5:38 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by pmjwright
Regarding your Athabasca Glacier research for 1835--the earliest travelers basically couldn't follow the current Parkway route because the glacier filled the valley. Instead, they detoured via Wilcox Pass.
This is pretty neat! Could I beg you to take a moment to post this to the "Historical Views" thread? http://www.clubtread.com/sforum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=30927
Technically, this is not near Skoki, per the thread title, but it is related, since the same individuals who will be near Skoki in 1835 and 1907 might have traveled that way.
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Calgary, Alberta
Andorra
3830 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 11:38 PM
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That is neat information.
You're going to love the 'Life of the Trail' series
quote:
Originally posted by Marilynx
It's the history buff in me... I want to know what people could live on if they didn't have packs of Ramen noodles and so forth.
I've been browsing through the rest of your photos, and did notice the plant shots. I assume you're familiar with this book?
http://www.canrockbooks.com/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=271&CLSN_553=1240669205553d2faaf054e98d2e9096
I keep tabs on the flowers I've seen, though I haven't branched much into nonflowering plants. What this also means, however, is that I no longer take photos of every flower I see unless it is particularly striking, or something I can't identify. We were slightly late for prime flower season on that hike too.
I've seen that book around, but never actually read it or anything else. I guess it's about time that I at least take a look (knowing that it could become another problem, as learning edible and medicinal plants is a lifelong learning experience). I love my public library!
I have this incredible book, which I bought for having basics on everything, as well as this more specific, real photgraphed, yet less comprehensive book because it was on clearance. :) and I have this book, which is entirely unrelated except for being by the same author, and being new and thus still incredibly exciting. And awesome.
quote:
Originally posted by Marilynx
Hmm, I guess living in Flatland with too many wetlands around me has me assuming "marsh" anywhere there's water. Looked like the shallow edges of some of the lakes, with the grasses and such nearby might have been marshy.
Your climate is relevant too.
One thing to remember is that we're on the rain-shadow side of the rockies. While there are some pretty lush places on the western slopes, most of what you're seeing here of the rockies is not far from the desert conditions of the nearby prairies. There's a reason the westcoasters laugh at us for even mentioning bushwhacking.
But wait, I lie! I was thinking of Arnica (which has a very rocky shorline) and Vista (which does have a bit of water-grass, but is mostly forest right to the edge) when I wrote that. I forgot that Upper Twin Lake was very reedy around the edges and actually had a sort of marsh at its outflow. Can't tell you what was specifically there, but it's the closest.
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2009 : 07:13 AM
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http://littlehost.no-ip.org/~rachelo/hiking/photos/trip_photos/066-iceline/1200x1600/66-iceline_58.jpg target= _blank http://littlehost.no-ip.org/~rachelo/hiking/photos/trip_photos/066-iceline/1200x1600/66-iceline_58.jpg /a pretty lush" target="_blank"> blockquote id= quote font size= 1 face= Verdana, Arial, Helvetica id= quote quote: hr height= 1 noshade id= quote i Originally posted by Rachelo /i br / br / That is neat information. You re going to love the Life of the Trail series hr height= 1 noshade id= quote /font id= quote /blockquote id= quote br / br / BTW, apologies for the clutter of URLs at the start of this... but they re not showing in the editing screen, only in the preview screen. Tried cutting and clearing it with Notepad, but it still won t go away... I don t doubt it. I was browsing RM Books, and saw several which I would like to have, but decided I d better not order them until I get back from vacation. Attending the Historical Novel Society Conference, which is being held this year in Schaumberg, IL near Chicago, then visiting with friends in the Milwaukee area, one of whom is planning to take us up to his lake cabin -- might actually get to do some canoeing. br / br / Your flower photos are really nice, and I like the fact that you ve added the Latin name to the identification. br / br / I have Ben Gadd s i Handbook of the Canadian Rockies /i -- it was one of the first books I bought. The geology one looks interesting, too. Me being the daughter of a geologist. Wonder if I can find a copy of it somewhere? br / br / blockquote id= quote font size= 1 face= Verdana, Arial, Helvetica id= quote quote: hr height= 1 noshade id= quote Your climate is relevant too. One thing to remember is that we re on the rain-shadow side of the rockies. While there are some a href= http://littlehost.no-ip.org/~rachelo/hiking/photos/trip_photos/066-iceline/1200x1600/66-iceline_58.jpg target= _blank http://littlehost.no-ip.org/~rachelo/hiking/photos/trip_photos/066-iceline/1200x1600/66-iceline_58.jpg /a pretty lush places on the western slopes, most of what you're seeing here of the rockies is not far from the desert conditions of the nearby prairies. There's a reason the westcoasters laugh at us for even mentioning bushwhacking.
Believe it or not, I caused a guy working on Salt Spring Island to fall out of his chair laughing. We're figuring, when my husband retires, of moving inland to avoid, at least, hurricane flooding. (We'd consider moving to mountains if it weren't for the 12,000 books which would be a bear to move.) I was looking at different building styles, and stumbled upon www.terrafirmabuilders.ca and rammed earth. Asked about its durability, and how it handled rain... and about two seconds after I said it, my brain kicked into gear and said, "Hello? Pacific Northwest? Can you say "rain forest?" Yeah -- the guy I was talking to darn near laughed himself to death.
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I forgot that Upper Twin Lake was very reedy around the edges and actually had a sort of marsh at its outflow. Can't tell you what was specifically there, but it's the closest.
Yes! It was near the Twin Lakes that I'm sure I read something which made me think of reeds and/or cat tails. I also remember reading about cotton grass in the area.
My reason for an interest in cat tails is because they're edible. This quote is from Wikipedia (because I don't remember which book I saw it in), "Cattails have a wide variety of parts that are edible to humans. The rhizomes are a pleasant, nutritious and energy-rich food source, generally harvested from late Fall to early Spring. These are starchy, but also fibrous, so the starch must be scraped or sucked from the tough fibers. In addition to the rhizomes, cattails have little-known, underground, lateral stems that are quite tasty. In late spring, the bases of the leaves, while they are young and tender, can be eaten raw or cooked. As the flower spike is developing in early summer, it can be broken off and eaten like corn on the cob. In mid-summer, once the flowers are mature, the pollen can be collected and used as a flour supplement or thickener. Cattails have also recently been suggested as a source of oil.The boiled rootstocks have been used for increasing urination, or used mashing, to make a jelly-like paste for sores, boils, wounds, burns, scabs, inflammations, and smallpox pustules."
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Edited by - Marilynx on 06/05/2009 3:44 PM |
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Calgary, Alberta
Andorra
3830 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2009 : 2:30 PM
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I'm very lucky to have the local library that stocks most of these 'local interest' books. I buy the ones I'm going to use all the time, but can borrow pretty much every other one around.
If I come up with anything else as I look through the edible plants book I'll pass that on.
That rammed earth stuff is really cool!
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2009 : 3:42 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Rachelo
I'm very lucky to have the local library that stocks most of these 'local interest' books. I buy the ones I'm going to use all the time, but can borrow pretty much every other one around.If I come up with anything else as I look through the edible plants book I'll pass that on.
Well, regrettably, New Orleans no longer has much in the way of public libraries. They drowned in the postlude of Hurricane Katrina in 2005. In fact, my local library, about a mile from me, hasn't even reopened, even yet.
And... for some odd reason, New Orleans libraries never did stock much in the way of Canadian Rockies books. I suspect I have more books on Canada, Canadian history, and the Canadian Rockies, than the combined university libraries in the entire state of Louisiana. (Well, I take that back... given that a chunk of Louisiana was settled by displaced Acadians, we have material on that part of Canadian history. My husband's family were some of those so displaced.)
I will be very grateful for anything on edibles you come up with. And you're right: it's a study which becomes a life-long endeavor.
The writing has made me a generalist -- I know something about an awful lot of things, somewhat more on certain topics, and I've really studied other areas.
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That rammed earth stuff is really cool!
They offer a weekend hands-on class in it. We're hoping to be able to afford it, and learn more. The problem, of course, is that having gotten all the way to Vancouver, it would just be criminal not to do some other things in the area! (Or farther east....)
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Salmon Arm, BC
Canada
900 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2009 : 12:38 PM
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| Hi Marilynx. The outlet to Upper Twin has reeds and sedges (no cat-tails) and quite a lot of cotton grass. I've only been there in late summer-fall so didn't observe other wildflowers. |
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New Orleans, Louisiana
USA
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2009 : 8:59 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by pmjwright
Hi Marilynx. The outlet to Upper Twin has reeds and sedges (no cat-tails) and quite a lot of cotton grass. I've only been there in late summer-fall so didn't observe other wildflowers.
Well, reeds and sedges are still a highly useful family. Pity about the cat-tails, though. Muskrats like to eat them, and I was hoping for a muskrat or two in the vicinity,
FYI, I'm bound for Chicago and Milwaukee tomorrow. Will be back when I get here. <g> Researching, of course.
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Writer Researching: Gibbon Pass to Hwy 93
