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Vancouver, BC
Canada
877 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2012 : 3:51 PM
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| Ears, nose, and tongue would not be protected. |
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2421 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 06:49 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by weedWhacker
Ears, nose, and tongue would not be protected.
True. I guess the treat makes the pain worthwhile. Of course, I'm not a bear, so I've never actually had the experience. |
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153 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 08:49 AM
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A little story... Ten years ago I was in the back country with a woman and her two children. The mother was wearing bear spray on her belt. As we were hiking, we heard a small pop, a fizz, and saw her yell at her kids to get away as she dropped to the ground. Being children they ran to her as she was enveloped in a red cloud. I yelled at the kids to run to me, which they promptly did ( good kids) bringing the cloud with them. All four of us learned firsthand the effects of pepper spray that day. I only received a small dose but it was almost overwhelming as I dealt with two crying children and their mother on the ground.
A seemingly good, fresh can of bear spray had broken its cap right across the plastic top and emptied its contents on the woman as she crouched over it, covering it with her body and arms to protect her children.
We were way back, and no where near water. What water we were carrying did not go far with four victims and naturally the kids were our concern. I took only a few ounces slowly, because I had received the least dose.
We then faced a 3 hour hike out. Those kids were troopers; their mother took a full shot on her clothes and bare arms and I can verify, she had full second-degree burns all over her arms. It continued to burn the whole hike out as we had nothing to treat it with but occassional patches of damp earth.
I do not make a habit of carrying bearspray. I like bears too much to do that to them. I have spent my life in the bush, and have never had a bad bear encounter. If we meet i announce my presence. Works, so far. |
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153 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 09:58 AM
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I had to cut the last post short.
I don't want to pepper spray a bear because it is not a short-lived deterent. After that bear runs away his nose, eyes, and face area will blister and burn for hours or days. They do not know how to treat it, and it will continue to burn for a long time. In my life, my experience is that awareness and gentle interaction has worked so far. In camp, there may be a gun in a safe place, but I carry nothing but a bear bell in the key of C. ( and a B F K, but really only as a tool.) |
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Finally stopping that crazy suffering that is ice, climbing to concentrate on great ski tours!
3523 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 10:30 AM
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I rarely carry bear spray, mostly only if I'm solo. I too would hate to spray a bear, as I really don't want to hurt them.
There are some that think spraying bears makes them adverse to encounters with people. I see the logic, but don't like the process. |
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Kootenay Bud
2695 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 11:21 AM
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| Getting chased up a glacier by a grizzly might change your opinions. Although it didn't really change mine and I still don't carry anything. |
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521 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 12:55 PM
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| Just because you haven't had a bear encounter doesn't mean you won't. Bear spray used properly could save the life of the bear AND human visitors involved. If a bear shows stalking behavior fighting back may be the only option, without bear spray. Then you may need that BFK! |
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Salmon Arm, BC
Canada
899 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 2:03 PM
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What I've seen and heard through bush work and bear safety training is that blistering is a very uncommon reaction. Perhaps the odd person with hyper-sensitive skin would blister up. I work with two people who were thoroughly doused by spray. Lots of burning pain for several hours (and for the next week every time they showered) but no blisters. And they both got a full can from close up.
But just because somebody MIGHT blister up is no reason to avoid carrying it.
As for a BFK, well, I carry a RLSAK (Really Little Swiss Army Knife)  . |
Edited by - pmjwright on 04/24/2012 2:04 PM |
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aldergrove, BC
Canada
42 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 2:08 PM
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I only carry 12 gauge bear spray,If that fails I also carry a BFK.
I would never trust my life to a can of pepper spray.
If a predatory or non-bluff charge occurs bear spray will not help you.
90% of the time when a bear charges you it is in fact a bluff charge.
I can't imagine how many poor bluff charging bears have been sprayed in the face by some asshole who thinks he is doing himself and the bear a favor.
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Edited by - tinbasher on 04/24/2012 2:10 PM |
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2421 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 2:22 PM
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I know one woman on a police training course who had almost no reaction to pepper spray, and there are numerous cases of people on various kinds of heavy duty drugs (ecstasy, PCP) who have to be physically knocked down even after having been sprayed.
From what I've seen, though, even a few miniscule particles are enough to cause severe irritation to any exposed mucous membranes or the eyes, and I've met a couple of people who got burned on their skin as well. Logically, something that can cause irritation at low levels should have a more powerful effect in higher concentrations. In my experience (although never having been directly sprayed with it) I don't think that burns are an uncommon reaction. |
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2421 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 2:30 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by johngenx
I see the logic, but don't like the process.
Me neither. I sprayed one once a number of years ago but only because we bumped into each other on a trail. I rarely run into animals when hiking, because I was trained to holler in any situations where I might encounter them unexpectedly. The bears I see in the bush are usually headed over the hill, and all I get is a glimpse of their backsides. |
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aldergrove, BC
Canada
42 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 2:56 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by peter1955
I sprayed one once a number of years ago but only because we bumped into each other on a trail.
why? |
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2421 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 3:28 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by tinbasher
quote:
Originally posted by peter1955
I sprayed one once a number of years ago but only because we bumped into each other on a trail.
why?
Because it wanted to come up a narrow trail and I wanted to go down it.
And by the way, guns don't work as well on an aggressive bear as bear spray. That why Parks Canada staff carry bear spray, even the ones who are allowed to carry a gun. And unless you make an extremely lucky kill shot, no gun will stop a charging bear.
Last year, two hunters up at Grande Cache got between a mama grizzly and her cub. Before they even had time to raise their rifles, she knocked them to the ground and batted them around.
It sounds like you only know enough about bears to be afraid of them.
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aldergrove, BC
Canada
42 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 9:02 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by peter1955
quote:
Originally posted by tinbasher
quote:
Originally posted by peter1955
I sprayed one once a number of years ago but only because we bumped into each other on a trail.
why?
Because it wanted to come up a narrow trail and I wanted to go down it.
And by the way, guns don't work as well on an aggressive bear as bear spray. That why Parks Canada staff carry bear spray, even the ones who are allowed to carry a gun. And unless you make an extremely lucky kill shot, no gun will stop a charging bear.
Last year, two hunters up at Grande Cache got between a mama grizzly and her cub. Before they even had time to raise their rifles, she knocked them to the ground and batted them around.
It sounds like you only know enough about bears to be afraid of them.
Me scared of bears?? not likely.
I'm not the guy that sprayed a bear that dared to walk on the trail you wanted to go down.
Poor bear. |
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| gyppo
Intermediate Member
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Edmonton, AB
Canada
753 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 07:20 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by tinbasher
I only carry 12 gauge bear spray,If that fails I also carry a BFK.
I would never trust my life to a can of pepper spray.
If a predatory or non-bluff charge occurs bear spray will not help you.
90% of the time when a bear charges you it is in fact a bluff charge.
I can't imagine how many poor bluff charging bears have been sprayed in the face by some asshole who thinks he is doing himself and the bear a favor.
I'm trying to figure out your logic,
You say using bear spray is too cruel to the bear, so instead you're packing a shotgun?
See what I'm struggling with?
B
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2421 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 3:12 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by tinbasher
quote:
Me scared of bears?? not likely.
I'm not the guy that sprayed a bear that dared to walk on the trail you wanted to go down.
Poor bear.
Since you weren't there, you're hardly in a position to comment, are you?
And you think it would have been kinder to pepper it with buckshot? Yeah. Right.
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Edited by - peter1955 on 04/26/2012 06:25 AM |
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Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
253 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 10:14 PM
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"I can't imagine how many poor bluff charging bears have been sprayed in the face by some asshole who thinks he is doing himself and the bear a favor."
He is absolutely doing the bear a favor because now the bear knows humans are dangerous....and yeah, like nobody who carries a shotgun to defend themselves against bears hasn't shot one who bluff charged.
You should think more and rush to judge others less.
"If that fails I also carry a BFK."
lol. You've blown all credibility right there. You don't need either, as we've seen, inarguably, empirically all you need is bear spray. I don't think you've ever had to handle a bear situation in your entire life.
"I would never trust my life to a can of pepper spray."
Even though there are literally thousands of examples of it saving BOTH the life of the bear and the human, and very very few examples where it didn't -- AND many examples where the rifle/shotgun was useless and the shooter died anyways?
Sure, whatever. You know better than empirical reality I guess. The world is full of people who absolutely refuse to learn. |
Edited by - Release on 04/25/2012 10:23 PM |
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1078 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2012 : 03:24 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Justa
A little story... Ten years ago I was in the back country with a woman and her two children. The mother was wearing bear spray on her belt. As we were hiking, we heard a small pop, a fizz, and saw her yell at her kids to get away as she dropped to the ground. Being children they ran to her as she was enveloped in a red cloud. I yelled at the kids to run to me, which they promptly did ( good kids) bringing the cloud with them. All four of us learned firsthand the effects of pepper spray that day. I only received a small dose but it was almost overwhelming as I dealt with two crying children and their mother on the ground.
A seemingly good, fresh can of bear spray had broken its cap right across the plastic top and emptied its contents on the woman as she crouched over it, covering it with her body and arms to protect her children.
We were way back, and no where near water. What water we were carrying did not go far with four victims and naturally the kids were our concern. I took only a few ounces slowly, because I had received the least dose.
We then faced a 3 hour hike out. Those kids were troopers; their mother took a full shot on her clothes and bare arms and I can verify, she had full second-degree burns all over her arms. It continued to burn the whole hike out as we had nothing to treat it with but occassional patches of damp earth.
I do not make a habit of carrying bearspray. I like bears too much to do that to them. I have spent my life in the bush, and have never had a bad bear encounter. If we meet i announce my presence. Works, so far.
Can't believe this thread is still going!
I am with you Justa. It would kill me to inflict such suffering on a bear. I have no doubt the effect may linger for a long time, and perhaps in some cases, become a serious permanent injury (perhaps through infection or some other mechanism). I don't begrudge people who use it when they were endangered (assuming they didnt' do something stupid to bring it on themselves), and if I had my spray and was being charged, I reluctantly shoot it. That isn't the case for me anymore, since I have carried the spray about two times in my life....and encountered bears...maybe a hundred times. I also have yet to have a problem with any of them...might I someday? Sure...but despite minding my own business in the bush and in the city, and being the most straight-edge person you'll ever meet, I've had more threatening encounters with cops than bears! |
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1078 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2012 : 03:28 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by peter1955
quote:
Originally posted by tinbasher
quote:
Originally posted by peter1955
I sprayed one once a number of years ago but only because we bumped into each other on a trail.
why?
Because it wanted to come up a narrow trail and I wanted to go down it.
Unbelievable. Yet, considering the culprit, not surprising. |
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521 Posts |
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Topic |
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Study says bear spray more effective than guns
