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Van., BC
Canada
274 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:26 AM
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I was looking at a Canadian firearms enthusiasts site and they often have discussions on "Bear defence," and of course it being a gun site, they are always discussing what is the best action and calibre to defend yourself against a bear, rifle or shotgun, slugs or buckshot, etc.
I suggested on that site that being bear aware and bear safe was better that depending on a last resort effort of using a gun.
I mean, I'm a deer hunter in season, but the last thing I want to carry on a hike is an 8-pound rifle if I don't have to. I know how heavy that thing feels after a day's hunting, I don't intend to carry dead weight for nothing.
You can imagine the reaction.
One guy argued with me claiming that a lot more hikers get killed by bears than hunters because they aren't armed.
Is that true?
For one thing, when was the last real documented bear fatality of a hiker in B.C.? I can't think of one.
There is the incident a few years ago now in the Kootenays when two hunters were killed for their dead elk by a grizzly bear.
Questions:
Do you know anyone who carries firearm while hiking?
Have you ever been in a situation where you wished you had a gun?
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Edited by - Michel on 08/14/2007 10:51 AM
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 double-double seeking, snow-chasing, short-cutting, vertical feet collector
4523 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:28 AM
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| pulls up a chair, makes a family-size batch of popcorn |
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Beaverton, ON
Canada
1295 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:36 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Michel
Questions:
Do you know anyone who carries firearm while hunting?
Hmmm, ..... is this a loaded question   |
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map hatin', coffee perc totin', garbage collectin', backpacking, action hero wannabe, who loves to hide out in Garibaldi park and will have his scouts sing if you keep him awake at night
2462 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:48 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Michel
Questions:
Do you know anyone who carries firearm while hunting?
As opposed to what, carrying a pointy stick? |
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Smurf Village, BC
Canada
1495 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:52 AM
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quote:
Have you ever been in a situation where you wished you had a gun?
Never.
Okay, assuming you actually end up in a "last resort" situation (which is rare), wouldn't it be faster to bring out the pepper spray than to unsheath the gun, load it, aim it, and fire it?
Alright, alright, so you're walking around with the gun loaded. Fine. But doesn't that bring up other issues? I wouldn't want to see guns being hauled around by the regular hiker!
Good for you on bringing up bear awareness. If you're interested in supporting our bears, Charlie Russell's Grizzly Heart is worth reading.
I'm in danger of going off topic... |
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Van., BC
Canada
274 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:53 AM
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Sorry.
Typo.
While hiking.
I have to admit I carried a rifle up Blowdown and Downton Creek when I went with my wife and daughter and felt silly doing it. |
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culmination point, B.C.
Canada
737 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:54 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Michel
Questions:
Do you know anyone who carries firearm while hunting?
Have you ever been in a situation where you wished you had a gun?
1.) me and my pals carry firearms while hunting (duh)
actually if you meant hiking, then i think northernalberta does. A shotgun i think
2.) Yeah, i spotted this great 5 pt muley i could have taken but was without my 270 Winchester 
can i have some popcorn Cwall? ... please?
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Smurf Village, BC
Canada
1495 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:55 AM
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quote:
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 10:48:17 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Michel
Questions:
Do you know anyone who carries firearm while hunting?
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As opposed to what, carrying a pointy stick?
Now that is the kind of hunting I might support!  |
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North Vancouver, bc
Canada
760 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:02 AM
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I would never had considered carrying a gun until my last excursion to the broken islands. I am now in the market for a good high powered pellet gun. One that can kill a crow from 100yds. One of my neighbours on the island was telling me that if you kill one crow, the rest will leave.....so I'm looking for an automatic, if one exists...
anybody else have fantasies of murdering a murder? |
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Beaverton, ON
Canada
1295 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:05 AM
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Cwall ... can I have a little more butter on mine, please? 
 |
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Smurf Village, BC
Canada
1495 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:05 AM
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quote:
anybody else have fantasies of murdering a murder?
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in the valley, BC
Canada
1456 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:09 AM
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One guy argued with me claiming that a lot more hikers get killed by bears than hunters because they aren't armed. Is that true?
Here's a list of fatal bear attacks in North America:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America_by_decade
Questions:
Do you know anyone who carries firearm while hiking? No
Have you ever been in a situation where you wished you had a gun? No
Personally I don't like guns and don't think I'd ever own one or hike with someone that was carrying a gun.
Cheers!
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North Vancouver, BC
Canada
1542 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:12 AM
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If I felt I needed a gun to be safe, and I didn't absolutely have to go, I wouldn't go. I guess this is the difference between someone who is a gun enthusiast and someone who isn't. If I was a gun enthusiast I would probably look for any reason to take a gun, and then a reason for why I might need to use it. I'm a photography enthusiast, so I'm always looking for a reason to take a camera, and I always seem to be able to come up with one that seems perfectly logical to me.
Who would like to start a pool for how fast this thread will reach 50 posts? I say 6:00 PM (taking into account the time it takes to get home after work). |
Edited by - magnetite on 08/14/2007 12:55 PM |
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Van., BC
Canada
274 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:15 AM
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I like your response magnetite.
I was going to tell the gunnuts something like that:
"If this was a golfer's site, we'd probably be discussing what was the best bear defence, a nine iron or a woodie." |
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in the valley, BC
Canada
1456 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:18 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by magnetite
Who would like to start a pool for how fast this thread will reach 50 posts?
4 hours from original post (2:26 pm)
Cheers! |
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Satirical photoshop junkie who frolics in the mountains of the Chilliwack River Valley
Chilliwack, BC
Canada
6897 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:31 AM
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Well for one thing, I'd carry a shotgun loaded with buckshot instead of a rifle as shotguns are much more effective in a quick close range shooting situation, but of course this would be assuming I took some sort of firearm along in the first place.
I love my firearms and explosives just as much as the next redneck but toting firearms merely for the sake of bear defense is a bogus argument.
If a bear at close range decides to charge you it will get to you long before you would get a shot off anyway.
Bearspray mounted on your side and at the ready would be far more effective in such a situation. |
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North Vancouver, bc
Canada
760 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:34 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Michel
I like your response magnetite.
I was going to tell the gunnuts something like that:
"If this was a golfer's site, we'd probably be discussing what was the best bear defence, a nine iron or a woodie."
Definately a Niner.... |
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Coffee swillin', wine lovin', Owl fearin' Andie McDowell stunt double, who sports retro gear
Vancouver, BC
5464 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:35 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Michel
One guy argued with me claiming that a lot more hikers get killed by bears than hunters because they aren't armed.
Is that true?
I don't know and won't take the time right now to look up stats, but my impression is that a lot more hunters than hikers get killed due to bears claiming the kill and defending it, plus the fact that hunters sneak around stealthily in the bush in order not to scare away their prey, while hikers tend to bang pots and yell, "HEY BEAR, I'M COMING!!!" in thick brush, in order to scare large living creatures away. |
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North Vancouver, BC
Canada
1542 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:38 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by BillyGoat
Well for one thing, I'd carry a shotgun loaded with buckshot instead of a rifle as shotguns are much more effective in a quick close range shooting situation, but of course this would be assuming I took some sort of firearm along in the first place.
I love my firearms and explosives just as much as the next redneck but toting firearms merely for the sake of bear defense is a bogus argument.
If a bear at close range decides to charge you it will get to you long before you would get a shot off anyway.
Bearspray mounted on your side and at the ready would be far more effective in such a situation.
Save the last one for yourself, just in case all the others miss. |
Edited by - magnetite on 08/14/2007 11:40 AM |
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Somewhere where I don't know where I am, B.C.
Canada
269 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 11:51 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Blucruisin
One guy argued with me claiming that a lot more hikers get killed by bears than hunters because they aren't armed. Is that true?
Here's a list of fatal bear attacks in North America:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America_by_decade
Questions:
Do you know anyone who carries firearm while hiking? No
Have you ever been in a situation where you wished you had a gun? No
Personally I don't like guns and don't think I'd ever own one or hike with someone that was carrying a gun.
Cheers!
Don't carry a gun and really don't care to. From this link there seems to be an increase in such activities. Is this an increase in the attacks or just more and more information being available? As far as guns go, I have done some trips in northern Bc where my uncle carried one and glad he did, we didn;t need it but you knew that you might. As far as the lower mainland goes the only time I'd want agun is if I'm on one of those hikes with someone that's just driving you crazy......
Totally on board with Rock Star's pellet gun Crow killing scheme. Just make sure you tied it up, that's the trick, others see it and know to stay away. |
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Vancouver, BC
Canada
1461 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2007 : 12:02 PM
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For hiking (trips up to a few weeks constantly moving camp), I don't think the protection gained in carrying a gun is worth the effort. The chances of needing it are close to zero. On the other hand if you are going to be spending months in the remote wilderness around one location in bear territory I think that it is a good idea. If a bear keys in on you being a source of food then it may need to be dealt with. Of course if it's that remote you'll probably be carrying a gun to hunt with anyway.
Wikipedia to the rescue with a list of fatal bear attacks by decade. The most notable is Timothy Treadwell who has made documentaries and written books on living with bears in Alaska although he is an exceptional case. His Wiki is interesting reading. Overall there are only a few fatal attacks per year so really the odds of an attack are small. There are quite a few attacks on hunters or fishermen with fresh kills. Bears definitely know the smell of fresh meat and know that it is food so they will be very aggressive right off the bat. I'm surprised at the number of attacks in Quebec compared to BC. I've always associated BC with bears. Live and learn.
So even after reading all that gore, I would never carry a gun hiking and have never wished to have one. They give me the heebie jeebies. I have a hard enough time trusting people with pepper spray.
There's been a lot of bear discussions lately. Maybe it would be a good idea to make a sticky with bear related links like the Bear Aware Program and the NPS Bear Safety site. I think that a healthy respect for bears is essential but that paranoia can ruin ones enjoyment of the wilderness. For me, information is power. |
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Guns?
